Replacing Fuel Pump 1987 454 P30

[lngfish]

Hello,
 
I pulled the old one off today.

When I looked in the cavity all I saw was a shiney shaft. I was able to push it up with my fingers and I assume this is what needs to be held up with grease so you can get the pump lever under it, correct?

I also see a pipe plug that could be removed and then push up the internal shaft but I did not remove it yet.

Am I suppossed to remove this pipe plug (1/2" or 3/8") and push the shaft with a finger up or work from the cavity where the shaft lever fits?

Advance Auto parts has (2) styles pumps. Airtex and Bosch. I wasn't sure which one was best, both$35-$40, so I ordered both pumps.

Anybody have experience with either of these mechanical fuel pumps?

Which should I purchase.

Thanks,

Steve

[Stripe]

I think Bosch would be the better "quality" pump, but it really is up to you.  As far as replacing the pump, Unless you need a new push rod, everything else should be easy as pie..

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

When I looked in the cavity all I saw was a shiney shaft. I was able to push it up with my fingers and I assume this is what needs to be held up with grease so you can get the pump lever under it, correct?

Yes.  If you can just push it up like that then you do not need to pull the plug.  You would only pull the plug if you cannot push it up through the cavity.

[bluebird]

You just have to be sure to get the lever for the fuel pump under the rod. They are easily bent while bolting on a new pump. I've always had someone bump the engine over while I have my finger on the rod to make sure it goes up as far as possible. You could also use a socket and breaker bar to rotate the engine over to accomplish the same thing.

[lngfish]

Thanks Coach, Dave, and Bluebird,

When I first looked in the hole all I saw was the side of the push-rod and did not know it went up, but I figured it had to. So I managed to push it up with my finger. I doubt the base of fuel pump will fit flat on the mounting base if the lever is not under internal rod, correct?

I may try without turning the engine.

If I turn crank bolt do I turn it CW or CCW?

Good to know I can pull plug if need be, but not necessary.  Just wanted to ask if it was necessary. Understood.

The local Carquest carries this brand Airtex and so does Advance Autoparts. They seem to be carried by allot. Read Airtex is only US made mechanical fuel pump.

I'll compare Bosch against Airtex tomorrow. Both are about same cost.

Thanks guys.

[lngfish]

Oh forgot to ask.

Will the internal rod turn (rotate)  or is it fixxed? ie Can I mess up in anyway but turning it if it turns.

Steve

[lngfish]

What it the best way to disable the engine ignition system so engine won't start when I TAP it over with the key switch?

About how much does the rod travel inside up and down?

No way to get my finger crushed I assume.

Thanks for replies

[Lefty]

The shaft doesn't spin in the bore, it just goes in & out as it rides the eccentric that's bolted to the end of the camshaft. So rotating it doesn't hurt anything.
Disabling the ignition is easy, on the side of your distributer there will be a wire that plugs up to the dist... the red one should be the 12v + supply for the coil. You can always unplug them all if you are not sure.

Use a finger to slightly apply pressure to the end of the rod as someone "bumps" the switch for you, and you should be able to tell when it starts moving upward into the hole. Try and stop with it in it's farthest upward position and you should be able to easily bolt the new pump into place Don't forget the gasket. Some wheel bearing grease shoved into the hole (or white lithium grease) will help the shaft to stick into place so it doesn't fall back down as you are trying to bolt the pump on.

As for a difference in pumps, both are good brands, so either should be just fine.

[lngfish]

Thanks Lefty.

I remember the plug on the side of the distributor and when you mentioned what to remove I rememver the coil in the cap when I changed it. Thanks.

Thanks for info on the pumps, both good quality. Gotcha.

I will work from inside the cavity and hopefully don't have to remove the pipe plug. I have some wheel bearing grease.

There is a chance, if I was lucky, that the rod is on the base circle now. Does any one know how much of the rod should be showing, exposed, in the cavity when the rod is on the base circle and what is the approximate stroke of this rod?

I now see, since I had not before seen, that if the fuel pump fails in a certain fashion the gas can get into the cavity and pump gas into the engine. I did see numerous holes on the old pump the I think are tell tale drain holes should this happen to warn the OP that there is a gas leak. I just guessing on this.

Thanks for letting me know rotating rod does not affect anything if it get rotated.

I haven't traced the hard metal line from the fuel pump to the carbeurator, I just see it going up.

Question:

1. Is there a regulator in this hard line to regulater the pressure to the carbeurator or is there internal way for the pump to adjust the final pressure to the carbeurator?

2. I just replaced the Diaphram in the pressure regulator back near the engine and there is 6 psig at the filter location.

3. Am I ok just to install new pump and not check any pressures since I have 5 psig at filters?

4. It ran fine before with 6 pisg at filter location, before I cut it back a little to 5 psig.

[lngfish]

Typo:

Regulator was back at the "gas tank location" on the drivers side mounted inside the chassis frame "in a hole cut" out for it. This regulator was pissing at the set point threads. I was lucky and just was able to replace the diaphram with a Holly Kit. See seperate post.

[lngfish]

I pulled the plug with the big fat RED wire on distributor and pulled fuel pump relay and had Wife jog engine till I felt rod go up with only about 1/4 showing. Just need pump, ordered, should be in today, to finish up this project.

[cncsparky]

I've used a hack saw blade before to hold the rod up while inserting the fuel pump arm. 

[bluebird]

That's a good idea.

Sounds like you're all ready to install. I'd probably go with airtex but either pump will be OK.  No regulator past the fuel pump.

[lngfish]

Thanks guys,

The only pump that came in was the Airtex. $35 12 month warranty. Looks OEM quality but hard to tell from the outside.

It would have been much easier if I removed the wheel since working over the tire you really stretch yourself. But working with the wheel OFF sucks too, especially if ur jack stand fails.

I wasn't sure at what angle to use a hacksaw, I got one out but I was unable to use it since it was hard to reach and I did not know how to use the hacksaw blade exactly. I ended up pullling the 1/2" pipe plug and using a screwdriver, with a helper, from underneath, to have them push up with the screwdriver on the rod as I packed it with grease. I used one gob( 10 shots)  of regular grease, then a gob of wheel bearing grease and ended up with the block cavity filled about 50% most of it pushed in the upper portion of the cavity as best I could.

Then I checked Rod 3 or 4 times to make sure it was fully up. I think about 1/4" shows, there abouts, when rod is up and on the base circle of the cam. It is kind of hard to see well even with a light as you are fingering around to feel how things are.

Then I put some antiseeze, lightly on the gasket, and some on the bolts and it fitted easily. Tighten it up with a 7/16 socket. I think the gap was less then 1/4" between the pump surface and the block surface when I started to screw in the (2)  bolts. My assumption is if the rod isn't all the way up then at this point you are smashing the lever on the pump. I don't know. Is it possible to bolt the pump on with the Rod down??

With the plug out, if the rod falls, it will not drop out of the plug hole. It will stop at the point where U can see the end of the rod poking out the plug hole. Is this pipe plug there for poking the rod up? I was afrad the rod would fall out of this hole but it didn't for me, which is a good thing. The plug is easily reinstalled after the fuel pump is mounted. Just use a 13mm or a 14 mm small wrench on the plug flats. Enough room there.


The hoses on the pump didn't  look too dried out. I did replace the 1/4" that looks like the recriculation hose back to the tank.

The larger hose, 1/2" with all the bends in it looked in good condition so I just put it back on. I would have replaced it if I knew where to purchase this hose. It is factory formed as you know.

All hoses with new clamps. I had a bugger of a time getthing the threaded tubing fitting hand started at the pump outlet where the steel line goes up to the carbuerator. I ended up backing off the Pump mounting bolts a couple of turns so I could giggle the pump some and try to get the threads started by hand. This eventually worked, but a PIA for sure. I dreaded cross threaded it. I did have a tubing wrench 5/8".

Replaced the Fuel Pmp Relay in Dog House, had looked for a fuse before but did not find one, and reattaced the plug with the big red wire on the side of the distributor. The plug on the distributor has lost it's hold down snaps, they broke, so I just made sure plug was on nice and tight and carefully added a tie wrap here.

Can these plugs with snaps be replaced, mainly the outer one I'd replace that has the voltage on the big Red wire.

Note: When I tried to pull the plug down/out, down, off the fuel pump relay, the plug and relay itself pulled out from the cover, that stayed behind, with the 2 nuts. Looks like this happened before as I saw some RTV at the base of the relay cover. The male spades on the Relay were really, really, dirty, so I got 10 Q Tips dirty cleaning out all the dirty stuff with some electric cleaner. I cleaned the flat males well, they were really dirty. Then I sprayed the female side real good, Plug, and after cleaning with the cleaner sprayed it with contact cleaner that dries fast.

Question:

I assume the cavity where the rod is all greased up with get flushed out with engine oil, correct? I'm sort of wondering if engine oil mist carrys over into the actual pump cavity or if this cavity on the pump itself get flooded. Just curious.

The Airtex directions mention filling the lever cavity with grease. This confused me so I went to a mechanic and he confirmed the cavity is on on the engine block not the pump cavity itself, which I knew already. I can see where a project like this could be confusing for the 1st timer. I have never worked on a GM engine before. Well in this area.

It fired up in like 2 seconds but I cycled the electric pump a few times.

Thanks for inputs.

[M & J]

Nothing like keeping me in suspense... I kept reading and reading looking for the "it fired up in like 2 seconds" line and found it at the bottom. 

Nice work btw. I've been a GM man all my life. Well done. 

[lngfish]

Thanks,

Maybe something in there that migh help a 1st times. Thanks. I got some good guideance here, Thanks allot.

Today I will run again and look around. I did notice the old feed hose to pump jumped around allot. I guess normal.



Steve

[cncsparky]

The pipe plug is there so you can remove the rod when swapping cams or if you think there is a problem with the rod itself.  I've seen where enough gunk builds up on the rod that it won't come out easily.  Some small blocks have a threaded hole on the front of the block that you can screw in a bolt to hold the rod while changing out the fuel pump.  As far as grease in the cavity, thats the first I've heard of doing that.  I'd probably put a little grease on the pump arm contact area before installing.  Engine oil works its way in there to lubricate.

[M & J]

I've never heard of packing the pocket with grease either. some on the rod, can be used to hold the rod in place while installing the pump then a dab on the pump arm.