Engine runs good but hard to start & what engine oil to use?

[The_Handier_Man1]

From: Liv42dayOK  (Original Message)
Sent: 4/21/2003 9:07 PM

My 440-3 is like trying to wake up a bear in the middle of winter (not that I'd actually want to try it).  Lately, I can't start it at all without pouring gas into the carb.  Once started, it runs great (except 4 the burning hamburger on the charcoal grill effect the leaking valve cover has on the exhaust manifold)  Any suggestions? - Sob



From: BraveMasterSpinner
Sent: 4/21/2003 9:34 PM

Sounds like besides the leak there is some issue with your fuel
system, I'd start by replacing the fuel filter then the fuel pump, then if
those don't help I'd spray the required ammount of carb cleaner into the
Carburator (this is where sitting next to the engine comes in handy.) And
make sure the timing is a-ok.

If that doesn't work then don't really know what to tell ya, perhaps your
not getting the proper compression or your carb needs rebuilt, or the plugs
are fouled, maybe the valves aren't seating properly. But these go beyond
my knowledge currently.



From: BraveMasterSpinner
Sent: 4/21/2003 9:46 PM

Let me rephrase that....

Fuel Filter replace... first.
Carb Cleaner..... next
Then Fuel Pump



From: rshaw500
Sent: 4/21/2003 10:29 PM

I had a problem with my conversion van one time like that.......not starting without help but after it ran once it would start pretty good........seems that there is an accelerator valve (dont know if this is the right title) at the bottom of the carb in the front.....a lot of times it gets stuck and wont allow the flow of gas when you are dry.



From: mightybooboo
Sent: 4/21/2003 11:31 PM

Good call Rick!!,its the accellerator pump,and the diaphram can fail and it doesnt squirt in fuel when you pump pedal.When its hot you dont need that fuel shot to get going.Sure does sound like Sobs problem.The edlebrock carb is an option,at least everything is new so no leaks of fuel or air.And it is that pretty red color,and us curtain people know color coordination is indeed an important performance issue.



From: nvdesertrat0775
Sent: 4/22/2003 12:07 AM

I had the sme problem after installing the Edelbrock. I found the easy way to start it (until I could get it to the carb guy) was to give it a quick spray of starter fluid.
When the carb guy adjusted it he said I should never have to pump the gas to start it. If I did, it was probably because the fuel had drained back out of the carb and naturally it wouldn't start until that was replaced. So now, with the electric pump, I turn on the key and give it a few seconds before I actually start it.
BTW... he also said it the accelerator should only be depressed halfway until it starts.



From: denison
Sent: 4/22/2003 6:20 AM

I presume the choke is closing okay when the engine is cold?  My carb has a manual choke, and I can feel it if it sticks.  And make sure there isnt enough of a leak for the fuel to drain out of the float bowl.  On my Holley the float chambers consist of castings mounted to the front and rear faces of the carburetor, and if either one of those gaskets begins to leak - which they eventually will - then all the fuel will leak out of both the front and rear float chambers.  In the morning with a cold engine, you should be able to hold the choke plate open, twist the throttle shaft open once and see the fuel squirting into the primaries from the accelerator pump action.   You should be able to do this if it has been a week since you ran it - but even with a good rebuild I think the fuel would make its way out of the carb in a month or two.    If its been a long time since it ran, I pour 1/4 pint of gasoline down the little vertical tube standing up between the primary throats - this is the float chamber vent - to fill the float chamber.  I also like to pour about half a quart of motor oil or marvel mystery oil into the fuel tank before I start up after a long inactivity.   And when first starting the engine with the air cleaner off, I have the fire extinguisher and/or garden hose right near me.   Please let us know what you find the trouble to be, cause we will probably have the same problem someday.         



From: Boat Nut
Sent: 4/22/2003 2:56 PM

I think every vehicle (except maybe the new fuel injected ones) has its own starting peculiarities. My 440 seems to start best after pumping the gas petal three times to get some fuel in the intake. I then crank it for up to 20 seconds (if it doesn't start) & pump it 3 more times. However if I do that on a warm start, it might get flooded.



From: Liv42dayOK
Sent: 4/22/2003 9:18 PM

When I held down the accelerator, either all the way or half-way, nothing squirted into the carb.  Lowell noticed this right away.  I'll let U know what the deal was once I get 2 it

2nd, really dumb question.  I referenced the manual 2 C what kind of engine oil I should use.  I found a whole table.  I won't B using the motorhome during cold months.  I hate the cold and I have no furnace.  Only the summer months.  I start and run the engine and go for a short cruise about every 2 weeks during the winter to keep everything flowing.  I found several empty quarts of 20/50 onboard.   I almost hate to ask 4 help on this but, I know about as much about mechanics, other than what the manuals tell me, as I do about curtains!



From: tshirtman
Sent: 4/23/2003 5:02 PM

I use 20/50 in everything, my motorcycle, cars and this thing. So far nothing smokes and everything runs!



From: denison
Sent: 4/23/2003 6:10 PM

I use 10W40 when I am not on a trip, or when the trip is in cool weather. I put in 20W50 when we are going into texas in August - where the low temperatures will be mayb 85f at dawn. Using 20W50 in cooler weather, like 50f, I had the problem of a couple of cylinders having no compression, cause the lifters were not bleeding down fast enough - until the oil got warmed up, sitting in the driveway. If you can find 20W40 that would be ideal in my mind, for general use south of the Canadian border. If your oil pressure is too low - below 25 psi at 35 mph on a hot engine, then try a filter change. If the engine is beyond 150K miles a new oil pump might raise it. If the engine must have 20W50 to keep the pressure up though, then it needs bearings I think. With the oil temp a 260f, and 55 mph, with the 20W50 I was seeing about 50 psi on my stewart warner gauge with numbers. Its a 413. 



From: james
Sent: 4/24/2003 6:09 AM

I use castor 20W50 in all my engines from lawn mower to my 135 ferguson .Have been for 20 years.



From: Graham
Sent: 4/25/2003 12:49 AM

I'd try a thorough spray with a can of carb cleaner -everywhere, inside and out - and check the fuel pump push rod for wear which after running and expanding
operates ok. I don't know if a vapour lock would clear itself but the venting set up could be worth checking too. If you have to keep pouring in gas to the carb,
I'd add some two-cycle oil to keep the cylinders from getting washed too clean.



From: Graham
Sent: 4/25/2003 1:09 AM

I'd go with something a little thinner than 20-50 but thicker than sewing machine oil!



From: Liv42dayOK
Sent: 2/17/2004 2:46 PM

Turned-out that the accelerator pump was bad and the floats went bad too not long after.  I opted to install a new Edelbrock 750cfm Performer carb from Summitt Racing in place of the Quadrajet that had been there.  - Sob