Need 17.5" x 8 Rims

[The_Handier_Man1]

From: kwtravman  (Original Message)
Sent: 2/13/2005 10:33 AM

My wife and I bought a 1973 Travco (R40) that`s whats on the vin.#. We are looking for a rim as a spare, can`t seem to get on the right track or source to locate it, it`s  a 17.5" with 8 lugs. How are the rest of you changing from split to regular rims. In Canada we can`t have split rims.



From: Liv42dayOK
Sent: 2/13/2005 8:47 PM

That size is standard on the majority '70s Dodge Winnebagos.  Most of our conversions to single piece rims are by scavenging junkyards for class A models, 1974 or newer, or watching for "parting-out" owners.  They can be made but, you're talking bo-ku money. - Sob



From: denison
Sent: 2/20/2005 7:59 PM

I would think the 17.5 inch rims would be one piece drop center type, made with tubeless tires in mind. There were split rims wheels to fit the 8 bolt hubs, but they would be either 16, 17, or 18 inch sizes. I think all of the wheel sizes that were for 16.5, 17.5 or 19.5 inch tires were always the drop center one pieces wheels, and I thought the tires in the .5 sizes were always tubeless type tires.

In the U.S.A., as far as I know, you can use the split rims if they came with the vehicle. For commercial vehicles made after about 1970 I believe you must use the one-piece type wheels, not split rims. But my Winny came originally with split rims, so I can continue to use them. I like mine, dont plan to change.
In most wheel sizes there were companies that made the wheels in compatible hub types, but they are of such low demand now, that they wont be stocked locally, and the wheel maker might not do a new production run until a good number of them were back ordered.
If its really true that in Canada you cant use split rims on a privately owned non-commercial vehicle even if it was made with them, then no one in the country can operate a mid to late 20s Lincoln, Cadillac or LaSalle, etc., nor most antique trucks from 1928 up through the mid 60s, including the famous Bulldog Macks. Nor the larger pre-war German made cars. All model T fords used what is technically a split rim, and of course much off road equipment still does today, like most all front loaders.
If I were to ask a young guy at a tire dealer in the U.S. if I could use split rims on my vehicle, without telling him what it was, I would not be surprised if he said it was illegal. He would mean that its not legal for 95% of the trucks he had ever worked on. 



From: denison
Sent: 2/20/2005 8:03 PM

Also you could post your question/dilemma on the "mytravco.com" site, in the forums section, down on the left side of the (slow) opening page, and you could also put the question on "travco.org", and at the "www.flatnosesociety.com". Maybe even at the "rv.net" too, though they mostly have RVs younger than my dog, and costing more than my house. 



From: cooneytunes
Sent: 2/20/2005 8:43 PM

Now I could be wrong, but split rim wheels either Multiple fo single piece, from what regs. I can find, are not illegal in Canada, or the US....Service Providers must have give proper training and have the right service equiptment, certain tools,  guide lines, and training for all employees to use. I have a 1988 Ford Bus with split rims (6) total , front and back. Came that way new, the only regulations that I know of are in the servicing and condition (must pass a specific inspection) of rims in the US and Canada both...Like I said, I could be wrong, but I've done several searches, and can't find any language that says they are illegal to drive on...anywhere...

Timmy



From: jsn80
Sent: 2/20/2005 9:57 PM

Most places around here (Kansas) won't work on them becuase of insurance purposes.  You can have 'em, but good luck finding someone to work on them.



From: denison
Sent: 2/22/2005 2:20 PM

     Thats why I am prepared to do  my own tire work on my split rims.   The only times I had taken one of my split rims in for work they did the job with no comment.  Once was for a flat tire we found one morning in the campground, in 1991.  The other time was when I had a recap that was delaminating.  I bought 2 new 7.50-17s at a truck place in Long Beach and they mounted them for me.  That was in 1993, and was the last time I had ANY problem with my tires while on a vacation.   
     Since them I have done all my own tire mounting/demounting.  I have had all of my tires off the wheels, to inspect/clean/paint the mating surfaces of the detachable rim piece and put in new inner tubes.   I do it with hand tools, and I dont consider it that hard.  At 60 yrs old the exercise is good for me.   If anyone wants, I can email them my description of how I do it - a long winded document.  Its not for everyone, but is definitely possible.       



From: chip
Sent: 2/22/2005 3:37 PM

i have to believe safety is not the issue--it's money.
split rims are more costly to produce and time consuming to change.
split rims were used for years and they were safe. nowadays big rigs run tire pressure in excess of 100p.s.i. that, i believe, is a little too high for the split rim design. by the same token, most of us don't run much over 80 p.s.i.-- well within the range of the old design.
most of us also don't run the speeds the new rigs go. [80 mph downhill would be a miracle for me]. split rims might also be an issue at higher speeds.
come to think of it, if you were in the boonies with a flat, you could change it yourself with just a jack, jackstand, tire irons, and a pump. i don't think you would even have to take the rim off the vehicle.
split rims aren't the hiway hazard that many people think they are.



From: denison
Sent: 2/22/2005 4:55 PM

I agree with everything you have said. The metallurgy and manufacturing processes for the newer one-piece drop-center wheels was probably too difficult before WW-II.
Safety is a factor though. With an old one piece wheel, when it gets too rusty it will leak at the tire bead and become unuseable, but it is still safe. The split rims can get rusty, and be unsafe, having had a 30 or 40 or 50 year head start on the new wheels.
I have a 29 Sterling, with 3 piece wheels; the wheel, the detachable rim, and a locking ring. The tires are 1200 by 24, 12 ply or more, and could have had up to 175 psi in them. That would be for carrying 20 tons or so on six tires. I used to run 50 psi in them, driving the truck around empty, at 28 mph. 



From: chip
Sent: 2/22/2005 5:21 PM

point taken. if the rims and rings are maintained, they are a safe design.



From: OldEdBrady
Sent: 2/22/2005 9:53 PM

I'll take a copy.  Never know when you'll need it.

edbrady@procomputernet.net



From: cooneytunes
Sent: 2/23/2005 12:13 AM

Just remember the most dangerous part of servicing split rims is upon re-airing the tire. Before you put the air back in...... several things need to be checked. No rust should be on the retaining ring, no cracks, dents, or heavy burrs, on the rim or any pieces, the bead area of the tire should not be worn or damaged in any manner. any welds should not be cracked... And most IMPORTANTLY...have some type of cage, or heavy chains, and a clip on air chuck. The cage or chains should be strong enough to withstand 150 times the impact of the ring and tire if it blows off.  A little story from personal experiance... When I was 18 working at a Ford dealer, I was filling a 17.5, split rim tire, brand new rim and ring, right out of the parts department...but an old tire, bead area was broken in an accident, I told my boss about it, he said the tire was OK. Being young , brave, and wanting to please the boss (stupid)...I started filling it with air, no cage or hold down, or clip on air chuck, Never needed one before, boss said tire was OK, so I had to get it done... Did several checks of air, all was going well... I was filling the tire standing next to a brand new pick up truck. My last check of air was 70 pounds, the ring and tire and rim all blew with a very loud bang, went 20 feet into the air, hit 4...glued together 2 x 12's (ceiling beam) which had 2 x 6 toung and groove sheeting nailed to them, & rock & tar roofing above that....The rim and tire and ring hit my hand first,  it broke the ceiling beam, and the roofing, bouncing off the ceiling, putting a hole in the roof, (you could see daylight) came back down on the back of that brand new 1972 Ford Pick-up truck, tearing off the tailgate and part of the side of the pick-up bending the frame on the pick up. This took less than 1 second....Missed me by about 1 foot comming down, When it hit my hand I was lifted off the ground and was laying in the back of the pick-up. Upon the landing of the tire....... Needless to say, It crushed my hand, pulverizing the bone in my wrist, it hit my hand on lift off, before it hit anything else. The force created by this was un-imaginable...........
I had done several tires like this and bigger before that accident... they never scared me..I have done several since... I won't even stand near the cage while it's airing.....and would not ever never ever never do one again with out a cage, or some type of hold down, and a locked clip on on air chuck. This story is not to scare you into not doing it, because as someone stated, finding a shop to do it is difficult, to impossible, most places that service farm vehicles will do it. But please anyone who attempts this for the first time, take ALL the Safety Precautions that are recommended by OSHA and the tire manufactures.
I am one of the lucky ones, that's still here to be able to tell my story, there are many that are not....Split Rims are good for the purpose they serve, but they can kill you faster than a New York second......So be safe and smart.

Timmy



From: denison
Sent: 2/23/2005 6:49 AM

Thanks for relating the sobering story. 
     My favorite restraining method (because its portable) is a heavy logging chain, wrapped around the tire and through the five oblong holes in the wheel.  I bolt the ends of the chain together.  I screw an air hose onto the valve stem, and connect the other end of the hose to the chuck on the air compressor.  When I put the air into the tire I am standing well away from the wheel, and the detachable rim is facing away from me.   I have the outlet  regulator on the air compressor set at 90 psi.  When I have it aired up I drop it over onto a concrete surface - still with the chain wrapped around it.  Then I feel to lower the air pressure down to the pressure I use on the vehicle - 65 psi for a rear tire, 75 psi for a front - and unwrap the chain.
    I inspect each wheel myself when I demount a tire.  I like to do this on sunny mild days, and after thoroughly cleaning rust, old paint and rubber grit off of the mating surfaces, I inspect for cracks or even shiny spots (which indicate movement) on the mating surfaces.   I use strong reading glasses and I take my time.  I also expect the mating surfaces NOT to be bent.  The detachable rim will be slightly bent by the removal process; the ends being "off" by perhaps an inch or 2 inches at most.   But you should be able to easily hold the two ends of the detachable rim piece "lined up" with the fingers of one hand.    I coat the mating surfaces either with a thin layer of a thick oil, or I paint them with a thin coat of rustoleum - if I wont be putting it back together for a couple of weeks - giving the paint time to cure. 
   The whole process can take me a couple of hours or longer.  That is what it takes for me to feel confident the vintage wheel is safe for further use.
     I dont blame truck tire places for declining to work on just any old split rims - and most of them are now olde.    If I were running a truck tire place I would insist on taking the same care the first time I worked with a customers wheel, (you dont know what abuse the wheel has undergone!) and the customer would be faced with paying the hourly rate!
   I carry the screw-on air chuck with me on trips, and the heavy tow chain.

    Another restraining method is to bolt two wheels together - the one you are airing up, and another identical wheel/tire.  This works okay at home, where I have extra wheels/tires and an extra set of the Budd wheel nuts.  I bolt them up with the detachable rims facing each other, the same way they would be on the rear axle.  A rim breaking off cant injure anyone.
    DISCLAIMER:   If your RV doesnt have the 7.50 x 17 in. 5 bolt Budd wheels, the two restaining methods I describe here probably arent applicable.   



From: smp5937
Sent: 4/6/2005 11:30 AM

I would think a person would have to just LOVE split rims to do all that...it sounds like waaaaaaaay too much work and maintenance just to be able to utilize split rims...maybe I am just a bit lazy, ormaybe I don't have the love for the original stuff like some do...I think I will stick to non-split rims, thanks!!! I did have a pickup with them one time, and when I went in to Les Schwab to get new tires, tehy talked me into buying new rims, gave me a price I couldn't refuse for teh white spoke 16" and new tires to boot. They WOULD have changed the splits if I had wanted them to, though...but I bought 16" to replace the old 16.5" split rims therefore being able to get cheaper (less expensive) 16" tires also...