Lug nut torque for dual wheels?

HandyDan · August 09, 2012, 05:42 PM

This is going to sound like a newbie question but I have looked through all the service manuals I have and can't find the answer. I have removed the rear wheels (including the tag axle wheels) from my '84 Holiday Rambler Imperial to replace the shocks. That part went fairly smooth although I'm too old to be hauling around the heavy wheels. After I got the wheels back on I started thinking about how much torque to apply and how to do it. I can't find anywhere where it tells how to torque the wheels. Any advice or help? My torque wrench only goes to 150ft/lbs. Is that enough?

DonD · August 09, 2012, 06:36 PM

1986 chevy foreward control manual shows 180ft lb in a cross pattern. I can mail you the pages if you want them, they are too big for posting.

HandyDan · August 09, 2012, 07:03 PM

Thanks Don. I was pretty sure about the cross pattern. I just needed to know how much torque. Looks like I need a bigger torque wrench, though. I probably should have one in the Motorhome, anyway.

JDxeper · August 09, 2012, 09:07 PM

There is some information somewhere here on the forum about cheater bar and torque. Something like 12 inches of cheater bar doubles the torque.

ClydesdaleKevin · August 10, 2012, 07:58 AM

Chevy's aren't as picky about the torque as the old Dodges, which required a LOT of torque. Not sure of the exact torque specs, but I just put them on as tight as I can with my 4 way lug wrench and have never had a problem yet! And that was with the 77 Itasca and the Holiday Rambler...which makes it no problems for over 5 years. They have never loosened up on me doing it this way, and with the 4 way I can get enough torque on the them without over torquing them.

Kev

gadgetman · August 10, 2012, 02:12 PM

That would be 450 ft lbs for the old bud wheels !!!!

HandyDan · August 11, 2012, 07:24 PM

uh oh! Now I've done it! I was taking off the tax axle wheel on the driver's side to finish up the shock replacement. It was my last wheel. One of the lug nuts was extremely hard to remove. I had to stand on the lug wrench and jump up and down. Well, instead of the lug nut coming loose, the whole stud came unscrewed from the hub. I always thought these were press fit from the back side, but these are screwed in from the wheel side. How do I get it screwed back in tight enough to stay? I tried using two lug nuts mated together and using the lug wrench on the outside nut, but I don't have enough strength to tighten it back in. Any suggestions?

Stripe · August 11, 2012, 08:55 PM

Do they even make a stud wrench big enough to fit the bolt? That would be my first thought.. I have a set myself, but none of them would fit a lug bolt... Maybe they do, who knows..

Also check this link, it mentions something about thread lock for that style wheel stud.

CMM500

ClydesdaleKevin · August 12, 2012, 07:11 AM

Here's a thought if the lug stud threads aren't damaged from trying to get the lug nut off. This is of course assuming that the lug nut is still seized on the stud.

Put some Locktite on the threads and reinstall it and torque it down. If the lug nut is still on there, it should be easy. That will get you going right away without having to buy a new drum or have to try to find a new stud and figure out how to install it. Mor-Ryde is very helpful on the phone though, so they could probably help you find it and give you the procedure to install it.

If the threads weren't damaged and it all went back in as planned, mark the lug nut so you know which one it is, and spray it down thoroughly for a few days in a row with PB Blaster.

Now, beg borrow or steal an impact wrench and a socket that fits the lug nut, cross your fingers, and see if the impact wrench will remove it while still leaving the lug stud in the drum. It might, or it might not.

Anti seize on the threads is always a good idea later on.

If the stud comes out again with the impact wrench, but threads easily into the drum with the lug nut still attached, its okay to ride like that...its not an unsafe condition provided that you torque it down as tight as the rest of the lugs.

Kev

HandyDan · August 12, 2012, 03:31 PM

Actually, the lug nut came off quite easily after the stud was out. The stud threads on both ends are in excellent shape. There is no place to put a stud wrench. No, wait, I'll take a picture and show you what I mean. Be back later.

HandyDan · August 12, 2012, 09:41 PM

Here is a photo of my tag axle hub. The stud with the double lug nuts is the troublesome stud. Thanks to my airplane mechanic son, I got an impact wrench on it and tried to tighten it some more. However, it would only go this far and then I was just screwing up the threads with the lug nuts. As you can see, I need to turn it one more good turn to have it seated like the rest of the studs. However, I think I'm going to just leave it as is and move on. From my searching on the internet I have found where you should never use an impact wrench on the studs because it weakens the metal. Also, don't put them on dry ice or heat them as that does bad things to the hardness. I don't know if any of that is fact but it is out there on the web. So how else do you get the blasted things screwed all the way in?

This next picture shows the threads better. I can get the lug nuts on and off fairly easy.

Stripe · August 12, 2012, 10:35 PM

Okay, I have a few of options here for you.
One: Stud wrench, check the link, this does not rely on the threads, it grips the stud using rollers.

https://picasaweb.google.com/117266653547607681099/StudWrenches?authkey=Gv1sRgCO_AnO79rfiePw

Two: Budd nut and wheel stud remover and I believe installer (again see link)

http://www.autotoolworld.com/product.asp?itemid=134520&gclid=CNXY1aPE47ECFQkaQgodAFAApA

Three: And this is if I see the pic right, An adjustable pipe wrench narrow enough that it grips the stud where there is no thread on the center of the sud. Do you have a pic of it OUT of the wheel?

CMM500

HandyDan · August 12, 2012, 11:17 PM

I tried to take it back out to take a picture of it but it is stuck like it is welded now. I can't get it to move either way. I thought about a pipe wrench but I worried about galling up the stud.

Stripe · August 12, 2012, 11:56 PM

Well, then I would count that as fixed, lol..

CMM500

ClydesdaleKevin · August 13, 2012, 09:09 AM

The only thing else I can think of is to use a narrow Vice Grip on the unthreaded part of the stud and see if you can get it to tighten a bit more.

Kev

DaveVA78Chieftain · August 14, 2012, 10:12 PM

For the P30
5 lug 9/16" stud single wheel torque = 120lbs
8 lug 9/16" stud dual wheel torque = 140lbs
10 lug 5/8" stud dual wheel torque = 200lbs

A torque wrench is calibarated at a distance of 12".
100lbs of torque = 100lbs of force (weight) applied 12" distance from the center of the bolt.

If you double the distance (ie 24") then that same 100lbs of weight at 24" applies 200lbs of force at the bolt center. At 36", 100lbs of force = 300lbs at the bolt. etc., etc.

I weigh 150lbs, so if a sit on a breaker bar (galvanizd pipe) 36" distance from the stud center, I am appling 450lbs of torque to the lug nut. I use a 48" bar so I do not have to apply as much force. I also use a 3/4 drive socket set to ensure I am not stressing the socket set to much.

Dave