Mr. Heater - Big Buddy?

[LJ-TJ]

Well my Coleman furnace is giving me a pain in the bum. So the question is I'm thinking of putting in a Big Buddy heater to heat the rig. Can I leave the Big Buddy heater on in the rig all night. I was thinking of putting it on the floor by the rear closet facing out towards the front of the rig. Hm?

[Rickf1985]

I know I will get flak but I say no. Two reasons, one is the carbon monoxide hazard and I don't give a damn about the oxygen depletion sensors. These heaters produce a pretty good amount of CO, I am not staking my life on a sensor made in China!! The second is the massive amount of moisture that will be produced by the propane burning. Everything will be damp and nasty.

[DRMousseau]

LoL! No flak from here, because those ARE concerning issues.

I opted against it completely today, on the issues of moisture alone. Temps got kinda low last night, and even though the main cabin furnace was set low (not sure it even came on), and the bedroom was closed off, there was still a lot of dripping down the inside of the all the windows. This is an issue that I really need to address, as weather gets colder, this will be nothing but building ice on the inner window sills!!!!

The added moisture of these heaters can be ALOT. I've seen mfg's state up to a 1/2 pint an hour and my windows drip now with some noticeable moisture along the inner shell in areas of lesser insulation, like upper closets and other enclosures. AND IT'S JUS ME in here!!!

[ClydesdaleKevin]

They do NOT produce CO by the way.  They do deplete oxygen.  They operate just like our Wave 8 catalytic heater, and we have used a Buddy heater in the past before we got the Wave 8.  Neither one sets off the CO detector we have, which is a good unit that actually displays ppm.  You DO have to leave a window cracked open near the heater so it gets its oxygen from outside...just an inch or so is all you need.  So yes.  They are safe to use, so go for it!  The only reason we switched to the Wave 8 was that its a permanent wall install...I was worried the cat or dogs would knock the Buddy heater off the table. 

Kev

[Rickf1985]

Food for thought.

http://www.cpsc.gov/en/Safety-Education/Safety-Education-Centers/Carbon-Monoxide-Information-Center/Carbon-Monoxide-Questions-and-Answers-/

[LJ-TJ]

No flak here Rick. Your opinion is valued and appreciated and your response was about what I expected. I just wanted another opinion to firm up what I was thinking so thank you. I'll try again to fix mine. Any body got a picture of a sail switch for an old Coleman 4023A5871. I can get the pilot to light but the fan eventually blows it out and I'm sure I'm not getting gas to the main burner. Thanks guys.

[DRMousseau]

Catalytic heaters use a platinum infused catalyst that combines the oxygen with the fuel and produces heat at lower temperatures thru the catalytic action, with water as a by product. Much unlike radiant/infra-red heaters that burn with a flame producing high levels of CO as a byproduct of combustion. Both methods consume oxygen, and oxygen depletion is a big concern. Oxygen depletion with catalytic heaters may go unnoticed and when levels are low enough, CO production begins to be an issue. Most have oxygen depletion sensors, which according to studies are very reliable. eh? Low oxygen levels with radiant heaters will extinguish the flame, uncontrolled fuel release can then be a serious concern.

Gov and independent studies find catalytic heaters to be relatively safe for indoor use, although most don't meet the ANSI standards for "enclosed" areas such as a bathroom or RV. Manufactures will specifically and clearly state that. They also recommend that two air sources of circulation be maintained, one high, and one low and should be no less than X square inches, which is quite small for most heated areas. There IS some issues of BTU ratings, and some of these will not meet or fall within the ANSI standards of safety.

The recommendation of using only small disposable propane fuel bottles is only to insure that these run for a minimal time before becoming any serious hazard.

One example of these studies is in the following link and there are others.
http://www.cpsc.gov/PageFiles/103972/CO03.pdf

As I said, the moisture issue is something of a major concern for me. RV's are insulated in many different ways. I have concerns that humidity levels inside may condense on the inside of the cold outer skin, trapped beneath the insulation. If this insulation is not tightly adhered to the outer skin, it will condense and further loosen the outer skin. Some RV's use loose batting for insulation. This will easily become wet and ineffective in keeping the interior warm.

Temps will drop here to heavy frost levels tonight,.... I'm watching the windows as a sign of "what's happening behind the walls!"

[Rickf1985]

The part about not facing flammable items is what worries me. In an RV which is mostly wood and vinyl wall covering there is little choice. Radiant heat travels pretty far and while it may not seem to hot right away if you fall asleep you could end up in a room full of smoke two hours later. Maybe it is just me but 22 years as a fireman and seeing the results of quite a few mobile home fires caused by many different types of heaters has made me very aware of what can happen.

[ClydesdaleKevin]

We are actually running our Wave 8 catalytic heater tonight at the rest stop.  It is about 3 feet from the nearest item, which is our dog's raised dog food bin/dish caddy.  The bin is plastic.  It gets warm, but never hot...although the whole rig stays warm enough even with the heater set to low.



Kev

[Rickf1985]

Do you get a lot of condensation when you run that?

[DRMousseau]

It's that condensation I'm concerned with most,... well, fire hazard too.

I have enough condensation without one, and I'm always checkin' the window sills, and walls below them, the deep corners of cold cabinets and the far recesses of the bunks for excessiveness. And I still worry about unseen and inaccessible areas within the ceiling and walls! While I much appreciate the efficiency of these, I'm jus not appreciative of excess humidity, moisture and condensation that can cause some serious problems.

So for those that use these,.... jus how serious IS the issue of condensation??? And/or what do you do to overcome or control it, if any?? I remember these issues being HORRIABLE in tents or other canvas enclosure.

[ClydesdaleKevin]

No more condensation than not running it on a cold day with 2 humans, 2 dogs, and a cat all breathing away...lol!

Kev

[DRMousseau]

A small dehumidifier I might consider,... especially if I had a couple dogs, a cat and,... and,... uhhhh,... uhhhhh, WHATEVER!!!

"NO MORE!!! No more puppies or dogs, no more kittens or cats! No more gerbils, hamsters, guinea pigs, bunnies, squirrels, chinchillas, turtles, fish, "SQUAWK!",... or birds!!!! ""What???" (yes,... a teenager popped out),.... AND NO MORE CHILDREN!!! Nothing more unless I can EAT them,... and they better not have a name!!!" (famously known rule and quote of DR Mousseau, 2010)

[Rickf1985]

Small, peltier (non-compressor) dehumidifier?


http://www.overstock.com/Home-Garden/Quiet-Thermo-electric-Mini-Portable-Dehumidifier/3103036/product.html


some models allow external drainage, into a basin.


photo of the Dyna-Glo

Read the description for that thing. Even they don't know what it is! They say fill it up and enjoy the cool mist all night, that is a humidifier, which I believe this actually is. Then in the description further it also says it has a full tank indicator? Any dehumidifier is going to have to have a compressor that I know of. Unless there  is technology out there I am not aware of.

[M & J]

It is a humidifier.

Lol That's funny.