Are my Front Coil Springs Shot??

[stopngo]

My Air bags are gone for sure. There is only 1 inch space between that rubber spacer on the lower control arm and the upper suspension where the top of the coil spring sits.

Will New Air Bags solve the Problem or will I need Both??

Thanks

[SLEETH]

hi, if she is sitting that low = it's time for some new springs

[Rickf1985]

You are going to need both. You may not need the bags if you go with the HD springs that most of us have gone with but when I got mine from Stengal spring they told me they always put the bags in anyway since it is such a bear of a job to do afterwards. Mine sat fine without any air in the bags so I just put the minimum 40 lbs. in them and I may even drop that to 30 and see what it does. It is so nice to hit a dip in the road and not have to grit your teeth for the slam when it would usually bottom out before. Keep in mind that if it was aligned while the springs were shot you should get a new alignment done because the new height will change several things in the alignment, toe in being one of them.

[SLEETH]

rick is totally correct on this one=new spring & bags  is the way to go

[stopngo]

Keep in mind that if it was aligned while the springs were shot

I think it must have been aligned before the springs or air bags were shot because the tire wear on the inside tires indicates a negative camber.

And ya your right.....I know what you mean about bottoming out. I just returned from a 3k mile trip.

But amazingly aside from all that I thought it handled great the entire trip. Apparently the negative camber gives a lot of stability in cornering at the price of tires obviously.

[stopngo]

Out of curiosity.......What would be the normal space between the two points in my original post??

[SLEETH]

sorry = unknown=maybe some one else will be able to chime in

[87Itasca]

How far does it sit between the bump stop/arm with new springs?  Mine sits about 2.5-3" from it when it's at "ride height". Not sure if new air bags will help that or not. Springs are original, with 42K on them.

[Rickf1985]

How far does it sit between the bump stop/arm with new springs?  Mine sits about 2.5-3" from it when it's at "ride height". Not sure if new air bags will help that or not. Springs are original, with 42K on them.

Sounds about right for what I got after replacement, I ain't going under there in the snow and mud, Sorry. W%

I had about one ince before replacement, you could clearly see how hard it was hitting the stops. Now it never touches them.

[stopngo]

Sounds about right for what I got after replacement, I ain't going under there in the snow and mud, Sorry. W%

I had about one ince before replacement, you could clearly see how hard it was hitting the stops. Now it never touches them.

I ain't going under there in the snow and mud,

You need to move away from that stuff.

[M & J]

I've told him that many times...

[HandyDan]

If you haven't read the P-30 Chassis Alignment article in the Member's section, I highly recommend it.  Towards the end of the article it discusses coil spring height and measurement along with alignment numbers.  Very good info.  Here is the link:

http://www.classicwinnebagos.com/Pages_HTML/FreeManuals/Chevy%20P30%20Chassis%20Service%20and%20Maint/PChassisAlignmentProcess.pdf

[stopngo]

Thanks Dan

[stopngo]

Sounds about right for what I got after replacement, I ain't going under there in the snow and mud, Sorry. W%

I had about one ince before replacement, you could clearly see how hard it was hitting the stops. Now it never touches them.

So what spring rating do I need??  Which is considered Heavy Duty?? My GVW is 14,500. Front end about 5 k. Do I get 5700lb rating or do I get the 7200 ones?

[87Itasca]

5700 pound. Most of that weight is on the rear axle.

[stopngo]

Thanks.......If 5700 are the ones and I assume that is heavier duty than the originals then the question becomes what rating did they come from the factory with?

[Rickf1985]

Call Stengal Spring, They will set you up with the right ones. They recommend the heavy springs for chassis over 28 feet I think it was.

[Rickf1985]

Here is the thread om when I did mine. If you get bored you can learn from all my mistakes before making them yourself.

http://www.classicwinnebagos.com/forum/index.php/topic,11401.0.html

[stopngo]

Call Stengal Spring, They will set you up with the right ones. They recommend the heavy springs for chassis over 28 feet I think it was.

Wish I could. We don't have Stengal around here. We have Canada Spring and Axle  and another called Scott Spring Ltd.

Will check out your thread. While I do that here is a You Tube How to that I thought was pretty good where the guy actually shows you something
as opposed to some that just seem to like to hear themselves talk.     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdLb_UauGEk

[Rickf1985]

I do not usually get excited about this stuff but DAMN!

That is the exact same coach as mine. That guy is a total idiot!He is EXTREMLY lucky to still have his hands in one piece after that stupid maneuver of jacking on the tie rod and then hammering the knuckle. And on top of that he had the lower ball joint nut off!!!!!!!!!!  Advice like this on You Tube is how people get hurt.

Now, I will tell you this, you can jack up on the tie rod end first and shock it with a hammer BUT, you only put just enough pressure on the end to raise it a couple inches. You do NOT compress the spring at all. Also, Be sure to get the tie rod off before working on the ball joint. The ball joint is the last thing you take off. Loosen the ball joint nut five or six turns and release the jack pressure from under the lower control arm. At this point you will want to run the screw down on the jack and then jack it back up to the control arm so you have plenty of room to go down when the ball joint releases. Bring the jack up to witin an inch or so of the lower control arm and then take the BFH and hit the steering knuckle where the ball joint goes through. The best way is with a pickle fork ball joint tool but I am assuming you do not have one. You may have to hit this pretty hard and several times but when it lets go it will do so with a lot of force as you saw in that video. That is why you only release the nut a few turns. He was lucky in that video that the spring did not shoot out of there. In the P30 it is pretty confined compared to cars but it can happen and I have seen a coil spring out a hole in a cinder block wall. He does not show the install and it can get real tricky as I mentioned in my post, you HAVE to get that spring lined up in that pocket right or you will be taking it apart again. Another thing to be aware of is as you are jacking the control arm up to put the ball joint back on there is a good possibility that the vehicle will come off of the jackstand on the frame! This is dangerous!!!A couple of things can contribute to this. On mine one was the rear air suspension allowed the opposing rear corner to drop an not let enough force push up on just the one front wheel. I was able to counter that by pumping up the opposing rear suspension bag. the other thing was the front sway bar, I had the whole front of the vehicle on stands so both front wheels were hanging down. This meant the sway bar was in the full down position. When I needed to jack up the right side control arm to reattach the ball joint once it came up to the point where the control sway bar was, even though it was disconnected, it had to push the bar up out of the way. The sway bar was doing it's job by resisting and lifting the left side. I highly recommend disconnecting both sides of the sway bar and do not reconnect them until the job is done and this should prevent lifting the front of the vehicle off the stands while putting the joints back on.

Remember at all times that you are working with a massive amount of stored energy in that spring which is transferred to all of the components it is pushing against. Any slip and you may not be as lucky as the idiot in the video. He knew how lucky he was as he was checking to see if he still had all of his body parts right before laughing it off for the video.


And for all of the work involved I think the 189.00 I think it was for new springs was well worth the price. Would you want to go through all of that and find out it still bottomed out and you needed to do it again?

[stopngo]

And for all of the work involved I think the 189.00 I think it was for new springs was well worth the price

I would agree whole heartedly but  I was quoted $425 for the Springs alone and another $400 to install total $825+12% Tax =$924=$670 USD

[Rickf1985]

I can't believe shipping to Canada would add that much. It is showing 132.00 for the same ones I got.

http://www.stengelbros.net/350-6560SDM-P303500-MotorhomeFront-Coil-Springs-4289-lb-Spring-Rating_p_100.html

[stopngo]

Thanks for the link.......I think I need more heavy duty than 4289 lbs.....No?? OOps.....I see the light. The 4289 is per spring

[stopngo]

I imagine the price is for 1 spring. Two Springs 265 +136 shipping =401 USD =557 CDN. Can buy here for 425 CDN. Hm?

[Rickf1985]

That price is for the pair.