83 Holiday Imperial refresh

[Eyez Open]

Years ago I quit tinkering with boats, that was a very good day...then I ran into a old RV.I just couldn't pass her up. I've coined her Louise.



One week later

[Eyez Open]

I removed the kitchen and living room cabinets, as they were too far gone to rehabilitate. I tore up the old rug and started patching the Luan walls. I was pleasantly surprised by how well the Luan had stood the test of time. I used a plywood filler to fill in nail holes and imperfections. Overall, I was quite pleased with the progress.

[Oz]

A lot of hard work!

[Eyez Open]

Next, I moved on to the kitchen cabinets. I visited Home Depot to check the prices for unfinished cabinets. Since any cabinets going into an RV need to be modified for durability, I knew I had to make some adjustments.

I removed the A/C outlets and rerouted the wiring to the cabinets. I created a false bottom and installed new outlets at the bottom of the new cabinets. I filled all the old outlets with foam in a can and then glued on the backsplash.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Hampton-Assembled-30-in-x-23-5-in-x-12-in-Wall-Bridge-Cabinet-in-Unfinished-Beech-KW3024-UF/302970248

Next up was the paint. I decided to go with Benjamin Moore Advance. This paint leaves a superior finish and is incredibly durable. An airless sprayer is the best tool for applying this paint, as it can be quite challenging to use a brush or foam roller. I now think of it more like resin than typical paint. In temperatures below 60 degrees, the paint has enough time to level out any brush marks or stipples. However, at 70 degrees, it dries too quickly, leaving behind imperfections.

[attach id=15353] src="https://www.classicwinnebagos.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=15352;type=preview;thumb">

[Eyez Open]

More pics


 

[Eyez Open]

Well, the kitchen is set to finish now. The next part is a bit of a struggle, replacing the flooring. The driver's side of the RV has suffered water intrusion. Both wood rot and rust have occurred. Having replaced more than a few boat floors experience tells me there is no finesse here...total removal.

Below are a few pics and one indispensable tool that allowed me to cut out the channel the old floor was mounted on/in. The wood was badly disintegrated it cut out like butter...Well, close kinda, sorta.
One can also see I have a rusty frame issue, I will be addressing that shortly. I will be using oxalic acid; it dissolves the rust, and most importantly, it is safe and quite effective.

https://azrust.com/oxalic-acid-for-rust-removal/

https://youtu.be/bXbOeOtHvyM




 

[Eyez Open]

After five days of continuous exposure to oxalic acid, the surface rust has been removed. I then completed two baths using a mixture of Dawn soap and borax, followed by two water rinses. Now I'm done.

After two additional days of high heat and airflow, the floor has fully dried. I applied Rustoleum rusty primer to the frame and the floor, followed by a final top coat of Rustoleum oil-based paint. The paint has a strong fuel oil odor, so high ventilation is required.

I should also mention that aluminum sheeting was used underneath the framing to seal things up, and fiberglass insulation was installed for insulation. Previously, there was a significant water trap, but today that issue has been resolved. There is no more insulation, and I have drilled water drain holes in the aluminum sheeting to eliminate the trap.

 

[Potatochip P30]

Looking good!
 Probably could have saved a lot of time just using Ospho vs the oxalic acid stuff as is chemically converts the rust to iron phosphate and you can paint right over without the post treatment douching with the ivory and water. Just heed the 24 hour dry time.
 Also the POR-15 line of paints and other products are made just for this kind of restoration stuff.
Now all you need is to drop in an 8.1 motor and a 4l80 or allison transmission !

[Eyez Open]

I considered all options for previous treatments. I have used oxalic acid on countless boat trailers, and to this date, none have suffered from recurring rust. Additionally, it is quite inexpensive. The acid effectively dissolves rust down to the base metal, which is one reason for the Dawn soap bath— I was rinsing away the old rust. I wish I had taken pictures of the results after the rinsing.

I will be using Ospho for the propane tank. However, since it is over 6 feet long and hanging, I don't have the time to deal with that project right now.

[Potatochip P30]

that galley is just "wow"
Is the counter top formica or stone?
What did you do with the walls - paint over them?

[Eyez Open]

The walls were painted, and the countertops were made of Formica. Stone is simply too heavy and expensive for my taste. Aside from that, this RV has a man cave vibe—granite doesn't appeal to me.

Since this forum serves as an informational exchange for ideas and concepts, I want to openly admit that I missed an important aspect of the galley. I usually mock things up to get an idea of how they will come together and how they will look. However, I was so focused on finishing that I overlooked something that could have been truly stunning, in my opinion.

Below is a picture showing the lack of a window cutout, with the countertop backsplash being covered by the wall trim/backsplash. If I had considered a skylight approach instead of just a small window, it would have turned out quite nice. Perhaps I'll revisit this idea another day; the adventure continues.

[Potatochip P30]

Still looks good even with no skylight - is there any way to get that window back in play looks like that would be the easiest to bring some light in?
 I have the funky cut galley that kicks out by the sink so the straight pre cut pieces are gonna be challenging - may have to get two sections with the 45 cut and join them but trying not to have any seam lines.
Really sucks these days trying to get people to come out to quote the work, just gonna have to figure how to get the top off and take it in to a cabinet shop.

[Eyez Open]

I had a few bids made on the imperial for cabinets..absolutely ridiculous pricing. I took a close look at the Navigator my friend has, those cabinets are basically a heavy built frames. They then took solid wood fascia and fastened it to the frames.

So I went to Homedept depot, picked up some cheap cabinets with decent fascia and built a frame inside the cabinet. It worked out quite well, attaching them to the wall is a bit hairy. Spreading the load of the cabinets across the entire wall studs was my approach,I am keeping a very sharp eye on the outer walls for deformation..so far so good



 

[Eyez Open]

Well the floor has been finished. Such a simple job in a house yet almost overwhelming in a RV. This rambler used a very high quality one piece OSB flooring panel. The sub frame was not designed to support multiple sheets of lower quality wood flooring the spacing between floor joists is huge.. A lot of additional  bracing was required...Read a lot of drilling into that steel frame...It is very hard strong steel..At very difficult angles.

Finally I can move on to projects that are by far less draining. The link below is actually quite helpful with installing vinyl flooring, cheater boards in a rv...priceless.

https://youtu.be/LU-1GZ8gFE8
 

[Mlw]

Seeing this really keeps me going.

Awesome job mate.

[Eyez Open]

Thank you, Mlw. Renovating an old RV is a unique experience, in my opinion. Combining a truck and a home into one unit can test one's patience, but it is ultimately enjoyable and rewarding.

The key is to maintain a sense of humor, even though it can sometimes be challenging to do so.

[Eyez Open]

One last big interior job left, replacing the flooring on the front pedestal area. And cleaning up yrs of quick fixes by the previous owner. Nothing to serious this time just time consuming and once again money.
 

[Mlw]

Especially money...    

But we know why we are doing it... 

[Eyez Open]

Finally getting to a finish, installing carpet is quite something else. Almost as bad as taking it out..read lots of staples and quite a few blades for a utility knife. Dull blades slows things down and makes for imprecise fitment..read ugly.

   

[Eyez Open]

Well, that came to a satisfying end! Even the carpet turned out to be enjoyable. I picked up a 10x15 remnant at Home Depot for $60.00, which is enough to cover both the bedroom and the driving area. I still need to deal with the wiring, but for now, it's doing nicely. At this point, the nostalgic seating and dashboard will have to wait until next year, unless I come across a good deal on some seats.

Now, onto other things: it's been almost 40 years since I worked on a carburetor, and it's quite entertaining to see how far I can get without a refresher. Here I go!

 
 

[Mlw]

It should be like riding a horse.

Once you learned you'll never forget...

... Or do you. 

I must say, i found the thermoquad on mine a whole lot easier than some outboard engine carbs in the past.     

[Eyez Open]

This carburetor is an 80s vintage smog carb, and I've never worked with one before. My first challenge is addressing the idle screw issues; GM used Welch plugs to restrict access, meaning no adjustments or servicing can be done easily. This is a significant limitation when considering modifications. I must emphasize that the modification I'm about to undertake is risky; a lot can go wrong. Taking a hammer and chisel to an old carburetor feels wrong, but it's something that has to be done. So, armed with a new $9.00 mini Dremel from Harbor Freight, I'm beginning the surgery. Below is my reasoning for restoring the idle mixture screws to functionality.

All of the idle fuel must flow past the main jets. Most idle tubes measure only .030 to .036 inches, and some are even smaller. To achieve the proper restriction for the idle fuel, you would need to use a jet/rod combination that has less metering area with the rods fully seated.

However, the idle system also feeds into the main system. As the throttle angle increases, the engine experiences a pressure differential above and below the throttle plates, causing fuel to be introduced from the transfer slots in addition to the fuel holes under the mixture screws.

Therefore, idle fuel does affect the main fuel delivery to the primary side of the carburetor during "normal" driving.

The significant difference between a Quadrajet (Q-jet) and many other square flange designs is that the Q-jet delivers fuel much sooner—at a lower throttle angle—thanks to its small primary bores and the triple venturi areas created by the rings around the boosters.

The design of the boosters and venturi areas also greatly enhances efficiency and atomization, making Q-jets (and Thermoquads) excellent street carburetors that rival the best fuel injection setups in terms of efficiency and fuel economy.

I've built numerous Q-jets to replace both factory and aftermarket throttle body fuel injection systems, and not once have any of my customers complained about increased fuel consumption or user-friendliness. I love the switch back to carburetors.

For example, a good friend of mine owns a Chevy 1-ton dually crew cab with a 454 engine, TH400, and 4.10 gears. It originally came with a throttle body fuel injection system. Despite his best efforts with the factory ECM functioning correctly, he experienced horrible mileage and was unimpressed by the power output.

We decided to install a 1985 dedicated 454 Motorhome Q-jet along with a factory cast iron spread bore truck intake. We also built him an HEI distributor with a custom advance curve and vacuum advance.

He had to purchase a fuel pressure regulator and set up a return system for the high-pressure factory fuel pump, but overall, the swap was relatively easy. He couldn't believe the improvement that the carburetor and HEI had over the throttle body and ECM setup. Fuel economy, throttle response, and power output all improved significantly across the load/speed range.

The only minor drawback was that he had to "pat" the throttle once in the morning to set the choke. Otherwise, he said the new setup outperformed the fuel injection system in every regard.

Now, regarding my first attempt to remove the plugs and idle screws, it became complicated. Opening the plugs from the front did not provide sufficient access to the idle screws, so I had to cut a channel into the carburetor body to expose the plug, and then I chiseled out the top of the roof. Caution is advised here; the plug body is surprisingly brittle and breaks apart almost like a hard glass. Patience is essential. The last picture shows the channel cut, the roof of the plug fractured, and the idle screw still snugly positioned in the plug. From here, it can be unscrewed. I will later post my special tool to access the screw, as it's still a very tight fit.

[Eyez Open]

I've found a diagram of the process and posted a picture of the final results.

New studs installed, they protrude about 3/8" outside of the carb body, no issues have resulted.

.

[Eyez Open]

I've completed the rebuild, and it was a very strange experience. At almost every turn, I was able to recognize what was happening. However, putting everything back together without force and achieving a proper fit was quite challenging. Fitting the power circuit was particularly humbling, with thick gaskets and delicate spindles. I now understand what is meant by "Quadra junk"—patience is definitely required; the Quadrajet is not a tinker toy.

Here are some links that helped me through this blast from the past:

I used Pine-Sol in a 50/50 water mix to fully dip the entire carburetor for 48 hours. Additionally, I dipped the carb body in oxalic acid for 24 hours, followed by a 5-minute dip in baking soda water. The acid dissolves any built-up corrosion over the years, and I noticed water intrusion due to the white buildup on the idle mixture screws. Some say the acid can degrade the carb body, but I haven't experienced that with a marine carb over the last 15 years. These chemicals will turn your carb black, but it's an RV motor, not a show car.

Removing the idle tubes can be tricky, so take your time. Use only drywall screws for this task. When the idle tubes are out, they fit loosely in the tube channel and won't damage the channel if used correctly.

Below is a link specifically for RV carbs, which are somewhat different from conventional Rochesters. They require specific rebuild kits.

https://cliffshighperformance.com/simplemachinesforum/index.php?topic=4486.0

These are HD truck/motorhome carburetors that use special castings with an adjustable secondary air bleed/enrichment system. This is likely because these engines spend a lot of time on the secondaries while towing or climbing steep grades.

Most of these carbs appeared on HD 454 truck engines, but I've also seen a few used on 350 HD engines. The special full tapered 61 primary rods are correct, but I've never encountered 78 jets in one to date. I suspect those were added by a well-meaning tuner who didn't fully understand the APT system, which in that model is adjustable for height and travel/limit of the power piston.

They have a rich idle setup for an emissions-era carb. Most of them have part numbers 17085212 and 17085213, but a few others exist as well, such as 17085000 and 17085003 or something close to that.

Be warned: they use different parts and gaskets, and using the wrong ones during the rebuild will lead to poor performance.

https://youtu.be/iCU20DZfv9o

https://youtu.be/NV6geJbRlwE

http://rmcavoy.freeshell.org/Q_Jet_bushings.html

https://cliffshighperformance.com/product/hp-quadrajet-rebuild-carb-kits

Here's a great video that goes into detail about secondary operation. Frankly, Quadrajets receive a lot of criticism due to their linkage system. It's worth putting in the effort to get it working right.

https://youtu.be/-zT8hgTP5WY?feature=shared

This may be the most thorough thread on the internet regarding the Quadrajet.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums/c3-tech-performance/4703199-rebuilding-joserpaq-s-1980-q-jet.html

[Mlw]

Yes, very recognisable,

With the Thermoquad I also received a kit with three types of gaskets, screws and rings.

both carburators are not for the faint hearted and that's why they are called ...junk but boy when you get these to work proparly they beat a lot of other carbs (or so car enthusiasts say).

I rebuild mine and didn't find it to difficult and the huge advantage of the thermoquad over others, reducing or even deleting vapor-lock, pretty important with our old style motorhomes with lots of heat producing V8's