Rebuild or buy new Brake Master Cylinder?

[weretrees]

I was talking to Alretta. They say buy their new master cylinder for my m375 dodge 1973. I was told by Cardone that they could rebuild it. Alretta said that was a bad idea.. What do you guys think. New or rebuild?

[ClydesdaleKevin]

Alretta certainly knows his stuff, but I also know in the past that there was some kind of issue with him...however, I have no idea what that issue was or how it was resolved. 

I've dealt with him in the past and he always steered me in the right direction and got me just the right parts the first time, although he is very expensive.

Kev

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

Alretta is always 300% to 500% higher than anyone else.

Dodge P/N is 3491977
That crosses to:

New Centrix P/N 130.83006 http://www.centricparts.com/  They list the M375 in their data.





Centrix P/N 130.83006 crosses to rebuilt NAPA P/N NMC P8569


Dave

[weretrees]

are these for a truck? the ports are not the same size on my master. Alretta told me that any other part would be wrong?

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

3491977 is from the Dodge MH Parts book

130.83006 information was for a 73 Dodge M375 at the Centrix site.  It is supposed to be for the style of brakes shown here:
http://dave78chieftain.zxq.net/M375Late.html.  That at least is what they listed. 

Early M375 would have used this style of system:
http://dave78chieftain.zxq.net/M375Early.html

Dodge P/N 2914462
Centrix site lists that version as 130.81001

Is it possible for the Centrix data to be wrong? Sure. If you do get one from Alretta I sure would like to know what the P/N is.

You said the ports are not the same size.  What size are yours?

Dave

[weretrees]

Thanks Dave. Ill get back on that. I believe the exit ports on the original master were two different sizes. I just got the new centric master and it looks good. Ill compare 2 night and get back to ya. Thanks again

[weretrees]

So the centric master ports are both 7/16. The original is 7/16 and 1/2 " so adapter or is this the wrong master. Everything else looks the same.

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

When I had to replace a brake line on my rig I ran into something similar.  While the brake line was 3/16 and used standard 3/8-24 inverted flare fittings, the master cylinder itself used a 1/2-20 inverted flare fitting.  I had to procure a size adaptor section like shown on page 47 (pdf page 49) of http://www.plews-edelmann.com/assets/1/7/AutomotiveFittings_90078.pdf and use a union to join the lines.

Dave

[brians69d24]

Advance auto and Autozone both carry AGS fittings.

http://www.agscompany.com/automotive/fittings/brake-adapter-fittings
I think you need a BLF-19 or a BLF 17. I get very confused when we start plumbing LOL.

brian

[salplmb]

i could be wrong but i seem to remember something about the length of the piston as being the difference. and that was why the part that was sold by allretta was so expensive. nobody could get the part # to source from somewhere cheaper and that was what upset allretta. that was quite awhile ago so i may be mixed up. but if we could find a cheaper part and # I'm sure allot of us would really be helped. this issue comes up allot.
keep us posted as to how it all works out.
thanks
sal

[ClydesdaleKevin]

Yep Sal...according to Alretta, the internal valving in the MC is different and won't work properly with the brake system on the old Dodge motorhomes.  Something to do with the port size and piston stroke being dialed in for proper proportioning.

I never had a problem with the guy, although he was expensive.  At least he got me the right parts the first time.

If I was going to shave some bucks, I think I'd try to have the original MC rebuilt rather than buy one that might not work right with the brake setup.

Kev

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

Wish I had the old one that someone had replaced.  I would take it down to Whitepost (http://www.whitepost.com/brake.html) and see what solutions they could offer.

Dave

[weretrees]

So are you saying the Master cylinder from Centric is the wrong one. Should I return it?

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

It's hard to say.  I do not want to lead you astray.   The M375 chassis has been the most troublesome chassis for brake parts.  Enter M375 Master in the search page (http://www.classicwinnebagos.com/forum/index.php?action=search) and you will see what I mean.

Dave

[weretrees]

So you steered me into this brake master and now your saying you dont think its the correct one. I guess Ill send it back. The Alretta guy says its not the correct one. Has anyone tried it? well ill just send it back and buy the more expensive one. Unless you have tried it and know it to work. Anyone? thanks..

[Oz]

As you're finding out, the master brake cylinder is a tough cookie to crack.  I'm sure you read the previous topic on this which Dave referenced: http://www.classicwinnebagos.com/forum/index.php?topic=3061.msg6842#msg6842      I think the last post on that one kinda sums it up.      I'm also wondering, with all the apparent near-misses on alternative sources and the high cost of knowing you're getting the correct one from Geoff, is it a more prudent choice to rebuild rather than replace, just as you originally asked?  In my (unqualified) opinion, I'm thinking that may be the better choice.   Hm?    The topic link above gives the rebuild parts info.  I wish I could be of more help on this one but I never had to do it personally.

[weretrees]

well i decided to buy the new master. Thanks for your advice everyone i so appreciate it. Ill have all new brakes. Ill spend a lot of money. but oh well.

[Oz]

What is the part number from Alretta?  This would be MOST helpful in the future.

   

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

weretrees,
Sorry about the confusion over the master cyclinder.  Was not my intent to steer you incorrrectly.   If the Centrix site had not said this was specifcally for the M375  I would not have recommended going that direction.  Hopefully at some point we can find out exactly what the correct identifiers are for that master cylinder.

Hope it all works out in the end,
Dave

[weretrees]

Its all good. The centric master is for an International Harvester. I looked it up at work. Im looking into a1 cardone to rebuild.

[brians69d24]

Dave and others,
I don't know if you know this resource. I recently stumbled accross it. It is a cardone/napa catalog.
ftp://ftp.frycomm.com/pub/old%20files/CARDONE_NAPA_MC_2010/Cardone_NAPA_MC_2010.pdf
I wasn't sure whether the master cylinder in my 1969 M300 was correct. As you know, most catalogs don't show motorhome listings so I take a chance with the "D300" listing. This catalog does show it.

So I looked up the number for mine. I then looked at the casting number and compared with the casting cross-reference in the beginning of the catalog and sure enough, it is the correct one.


brian

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

Thanks for the link Brian.  I will see if I can make any sense out of this information this week.

Dave

[brians69d24]

In fact only two were shown for the 68-71 d300/m300. One for manual brakes (1 1/8") and one for power brakes (1 1/4 "). I am assuming front disc came along in 72, changing things around.

  If someone makes a claim that I need to buy their "special" master cylinder, well, it would certainly be in conflict with the Napa parts manual.

[weretrees]

So Napa had the correct listing for my '73 M375. Found the master cylinder and it was the correct one. Unfortunately, they dont make it anymore. But for the price of the rebuild they were selling, they would rebuild my Master. So i sent it off to them and they have sent it to A1 Cardone. I will keep you posted as to the outcome.

I am going to replace all the steel lines too. I just have to make those.  Brake Hoses for this rig. Are they the ones Centric has? Or are those still readily available. I havent really looked yet. 

[Oz]

http://www.classicwinnebagos.com/forum/index.php?topic=289.msg289#msg289


There's others too if you put brake hose in the search.