440 to diesel conversion: Pros & Cons?

Firemansred · July 11, 2012, 10:03 PM

Sent: 3/29/2005 3:55 PM

I noticed several older discussions about this conversion...

1. what are the results positive and negative??

2. how difficult is the swap, (bolt up-custom fit)??

3. is the MPG and extra power worth the cost??

If anyone has tried this conversion and it has worked for you please reply... Thanks, Matt

denisondc · July 11, 2012, 10:04 PM

Sent: 3/30/2005 7:14 AM

There was a guy on the mytravco.com site, who reported pretty well on the gas-to-diesel conversion he did to his Travco - which was on a Dodge M400 chassis, having a 413 engine and 727 transmission. Mytravco.com can be a slow loading site, but after the links on the left appear, click on â€œforumsâ€. Then choose the forum about â€œengine - non dodgeâ€. The guy who did the conversion is enamed michigandon, and the last time I checked he has an msn group with good pictures and text on what he did: groups.msn.com/michigandonstravco (still a good link, but will change in Feb. 09).
The URL: www.turbodieselregister.com might also be relevant.
The discussion on the mytravco.com site includes mention of the drive shaft speed and what might be done about it. Unless you change the rear axle ratio somehow, the drive shaft in an M400 is turning fairly fast for a diesel engine. My 72 drive shaft, with the usual 4.55 rear axle ratio is turning 2780 rpm at 60 mph. If you don't have a lock-up type torque converter, that means engine rpm is about 3000 rpm on level ground.
I cant recall on which forum I saw it, but I remember reading that he was pleased that the whole conversion cost had been within his budget estimate of $10k. He was also pleased with the results after driving it a couple of thousand miles.

I don't personally have any interest in changing to a diesel. I don't have $10k either. Their advantages are clear if you drive Many miles. But....... since we only do about 4000 miles annually, and my engine at 96k miles has never needed rebuilding and isn't worn out yet; I don't think I need more reliability. Nor do I care for that high pitched noise.
It is common to read about how reliable the diesel engine was in some pickup or delivery truck that is driven 300,000 miles in 4 or 5 years, but how good would that reliability be after 30 years? Especially if it would be sitting unused for months at a time?
My Winnebago is 33 years old. I have owned it for 14 years, and put 46,000 miles on it in addition to the 50,000 it had when I bought it. Aside from needing its ignition points replaced in Houston one day, it gave me â€œunderwayâ€ engine trouble only ONCE in that time, when a push rod that had been making a tick noise for years wore in two. Its the only time we have had it towed. At home I found the engine had suffered no damage as a result of the push rod failure, and that I could have kept on driving it the 200 miles home on 7 cylinders.
[ Replacing the ignition points in Houston took 15 minutes, and I didn't even get out of the vehicle. ]
I would be glad to hear from someone who had been running a diesel powered motor home (that was over 20 years old and which they had owned for at least 10 years) to learn if it was as trouble free and easy to maintain as my 413 engine is.

Derrek · July 11, 2012, 10:05 PM

Sent: 3/30/2005 11:54 AM

OK Denison! Here we go, locking horns again!...lol

Denison is a great friend, but he and I disagree on diesel engines!

You will be happy to know that I will not suggest a diesel conversion in this thread. While I love diesel engines and feel that are superior to gas engines, I think that in this case, there may be a better and cheaper way to increase overall fuel economy.

I have done research on diesel conversions and have found that the average cost when doing the labor yourself would be around $4000.

The main advantage to doing a diesel conversion would be the use of bio-diesel. http://www.biodieselnow.com/ Bio-diesel is "Diesel fuel" made from vegetable or soybean oil, etc. Bio-diesel costs about 30 cents a gallon compared to $2.40 or so at the pump. For the sake of argument, lets forget the bio-diesel for now.

I would guess that a 5.9 Cummins diesel conversion in a Winnebago would improve fuel mileage into the 12-14 mpg range at a cost of around $4000.

On the other hand, if you already have a healthy gas engine, a better alternative may be to convert to an overdrive transmission with a lockup converter and fuel injection.

In a recent thread, Slantsixness (Tom) was discussing taking the fuel injection components from a donor vehicle (late 80's or 90's Dodge van or truck) and installing it on the motor home. If you were able to get a donor vehicle that was equipped with fuel injection and the A518 transmission ( A727 with an overdrive and a lockup converter) you would probably be able to boost your gasoline engines fuel mileage into the 12-14 mpg range for slightly more than the cost of the donor vehicle.

I am not sure that the A518 would hold up in my Apollo motor home because of the total weight. Pulling my toad, my total weight is around 19,000 lbs compared to the 10,000 lbs or so of a 20' Winnebago.

Derrek

Slantsixness · July 11, 2012, 10:06 PM

Sent: 3/30/2005 2:07 PM

No A518 trans here, just the fuel injection, intake computer, wiring, dash, other stuff...
The A518 is by no means as strong as the old A727... it just looks like it!

Better still.... the donor van was free!

Now if it'll just stop raining.......I can get down to serious work, or I'll be tenting it at the Jams!

But to answer the diesel question:

Why?

If you've got more money than you know what to do with, and can stand the noise of a cummins graveling beneath your feet and a stinky cabin... sure.... go ahead....

Bio-diesel... fuel made from French fry oil.... I like it! There's actually a LeSharo (yeah, it's a Winnebago!) running around the US that runs on Bio-diesel called the "Green machine". They do have to tow the fuel conversion tub around behind them!
Be VERY careful of what people call "Bio-diesel" Some of this stuff is not tested, and has cetane ratings so low, that the average diesel vehicle motor will not run. There's a story about bad bio-diesel on the "Green Machine's" website.
Oh yeah, that's a renault diesel in a LeSharo.... not a Cummins.. BIG difference.

Injected-slanty

Slantsixness · July 11, 2012, 10:07 PM

Sent: 3/30/2005 2:15 PM

Oops!
It's called the "veggie Van"

See it here:

http://www.biodieselamerica.org/biosite/index.php?id=3,0,0,1,0,0
Go to the link on the left column for the "Veggie Van"

But they do refer to it as the "Green Grease Machine"

Tom

Derrek · July 11, 2012, 10:07 PM

Sent: 3/30/2005 2:31 PM

Someone here had done an A518 conversion awhile back.... I wonder how it held up???

Derrek · July 11, 2012, 10:08 PM

Sent: 3/30/2005 6:51 PM

Whoa! Correction to my first post! The A518 will only bolt up to small block applications (318,360)

You can purchase an adapter, but they are expensive, so this would have to be considered in the overall cost. I checked the price of an adapter for a six bolt crank is $549 and $639 for an eight bolt crank. This info is from www.transmissioncenter.net

I also found this chart at www.dodgeram.org

Note the GCVW (Gross combined vehicle weight) rating of the A518 is 14,000lbs

I am neither for or against swapping to a different transmission, I just wanted to pass this info along so it would be available to those who may be considering it.

Automatic, 4-Speed Overdrive Gear Ratios
Transmission 42RH 46RH (A518) 47RH (A618)
1st Gear 2.74 2.45 2.45
2nd Gear 1.54 1.45 1.45
3rd Gear 1.00 1.00 1.00
4th Gear 0.69 0.69 0.69
R Gear 2.21 2.21 2.21
Torque Converter
Diameter 273 mm
(10.75 in.) 273 mm
(10.75 in.) 310 mm
(12.2 in.)
Input Torque
Rating (ft-lb) NA NA 450
GCVW (lb) 7,800 14,000 19,000
Application V6 2WD

V6 4WD, V8
V10, Diesel

Slantsixness · July 11, 2012, 10:09 PM

Sent: 3/30/2005 9:04 PM

And in response to the 12-14 MPG,

Time will tell, but I think I can get the 318 to at least 13mpg with the fuel injection and the proper cam timing, etc. It's a fun project....

I'm not quite sure when it will all be finished though, but happily I say it will be soon! (of course, the rest of the coach is screaming for stuff, too!)

Tom

Firemansred · July 11, 2012, 10:09 PM

Sent: 3/31/2005 10:55 AM

This thread was more for general interest, but switching to an overdrive transmission did catch my attention....

Torque converters, its 27 years old 45,000 miles, worth a swap??? do they make a 727 transmission with an overdrive??? thanks again for the input..

denisondc · July 11, 2012, 10:10 PM

Sent: 3/31/2005 11:19 AM

My 727 is 33 years old, 96k miles, the original torque converter, tranny and engine. never rebuilt, not worn out yet. I don't plan to change a design that is so durable; So when mine wears out, I will rebuild and reinstall.

The 727 didn't come with an overdrive, though you could get an aux. transmission, which replaced the 727 tail-housing and output shaft. It also required changes to the drive shaft, and if your RV had the transmission mounted parking brake, I believe it left you without a parking brake.

MSN Member · July 11, 2012, 10:10 PM

Sent: 4/2/2005 4:58 PM

If you were going to swap a 440 for a 5.9 Cummins you would have to use the A618, this is the correct application for the Diesel pick-up. My Ram has this combo and it works very well. I haven't (thank goodness) had any major problems with either the trans or the motor so I'm overall very pleased with this package. The Duramax Diesel and the Allison 6 speed auto tranny offered by Chevy is also a great combo. I just wish I could have gotten that Allison in my Dodge.
I hate to say it again, but I still don't see anyone getting 14 mpg out of the 5.9 Cummins and A618 in a Winne. A Winne has all of the aerodynamics of a sheet of plywood lashed on the front of a pick-up. I only get about 13.5 to 14.4 mpg per tank local driving, and about 17 mpg on long trips not towing. My truck is a 2002 Dodge Ram 2500 5.9 liter, 24 valve Cummins, 4x4, quad cab, short bed. And diesel is $2.40 a gallon compared to $2.09 for gas here in PA right now. It cost me $65 yesterday to fill my pick-up.

Derrek · July 11, 2012, 10:11 PM

Sent: 4/3/2005 2:17 PM

I was referring to doing a swap from the 727 to the A518 behind the factory gas engine.

Jlogue88 · July 11, 2012, 10:11 PM

Sent: 4/7/2005 5:32 PM

I recently purchased a Dodge Ram 2500 with the Cummings 600 Diesel, I cant believe the gas mileage ( I know a truck takes less to push than a motor home) but I can get almost 19 mpg highway and about 15-16.5 city according to the computer. This is a great improvement over my last truck an 02 Ram 2500 with a 360, I don't think I could get 14 highway going downhill with the wind to my back. It was a gas hog!! Beside the fact that the Cummins has 325hp and 610Ft/lbs of torque as opposed to 245hp and 380ft/lbs with my 02 360. All that torque can make for some good burn outs! (only did that a few times, couldn't help it.) And its the quietest diesel I've ever heard and its not just sound isolation, the motor is designed to run quieter. My brother had one in the early 90s and you couldn't hear yourself think while in or around the truck. I couldn't drive with an older diesel siting right next to me. That would be the biggest problem for me.
Just commenting on how I like the Cummings motor,
Jim

Derrek · July 11, 2012, 10:12 PM

Sent: 4/7/2005 9:03 PM

Great to hear some positive comments on a diesel engine!

A buddy of mine is the parts manager at a local Dodge dealership. About a year ago, there were two 2001 Dodge Ram, extended cab, (club cab) long beds,4x4s, on their lot. One had a 360 and the other a Cummins diesel (both engines stock). Knowing that I have owned and like diesels, and that the trucks were identical with exception to the engines and the color, he wanted me to test drive both trucks.
I took both trucks down the street a few blocks to the highway entrance ramp, starting with the 360 powered truck. At the top of the ramp, I floored the gas engine and merged onto the highway at a little over 65 mph. I then took the Cummins powered truck and did the same thing, only this time I lifted off the throttle and jumped on the brakes at 90 mph, near the bottom of the ramp, for fear of rear-ending a car while attempting to merge. That truck would haul in more ways than one!

I have yet to drive a Hemi powered Ram, but my buddy said that they will give a Cummins a run for their money....

Jlogue88 · July 11, 2012, 10:13 PM

Sent: 4/8/2005 11:40 AM

I don't think that the hemi will be a big problem for the Cummings. I drove a hemi powered ram and wasn't all that impressed, its fast but it has half the torque of the Cummins and it develops most of it at 5,000 rpm's. Not good for towing. With 2, 30' trailers full of wood working equipment I need low end torque. 610ft/lbs @ 1400 rpm's should do.

Derrek · July 11, 2012, 10:13 PM

Sent: 4/8/2005 12:32 PM

From a performance standpoint, the Hemi would be a better match against the Cummins than a 360 would be. From a fuel economy, towing, dependability, and resale value standpoint, it is clear to see which engine stands out from the rest.

It sounds like you have yourself a very nice truck, that you will be enjoying for a very long time!

Derrek · July 11, 2012, 10:14 PM

Sent: 4/13/2005 12:54 PM

I found some specific info on a diesel conversion at http://www.fostertruck.com/cummins/index.html

Here is the total cost of the conversion:

total cost

Engine, tranny, $ 1,500.00**

Exh brake, $ 800.00

Exhaust, $ 345.00

Rear axle Cover, $ 300.00

Cross members/mounts, $ 250.00

Drive line, $ 600.00

Radiator, $ 395.00

Fan/parts, $ 320.00

Intercooler, $ 400.00

Gauges, $ 171.37

Total: $ 5,081.37

**I got this engine and tranny from a wreck I bought at auction. I have attached the link for the auction company. I watched this site, signed up ($100) and made a few trips to the auctions. I watched a few wrecks go for all different prices depending on who wanted what and the condition of the vehicle. I finally got mine, it was a complete total, I mean really bad. The only thing left was the engine, tranny and rear axle. It was perfect for what I needed. There are a lot of guys out there that buy Rams and rebuild the for sale, this drives the price up a little. It just takes patience and a little work to find what you want. Most wrecks go for around $3000-$5000. I was just there when a one came through that nobody wanted. The harder I work, the luckier I get!

Here is a fuel mileage chart for the conversion:

Acum Miles Miles Gallons mpg/tank Running average mpg
223.6 223.6 11.9 18.81 18.81
469.5 244.4 28.8 8.48 11.54
1097.8 628.3 50.3 12.48 12.06
1973.5 875.8 55.9 15.67 13.43
2735.5 762 43.1 17.7 14.4
3497.5 762 55.2 13.8 14.26
4197.5 700 50.5 13.87 14.2
4930.5 733 57 12.86 13.98

This spreadsheet is from my last trip to Cabo San Lucas from Seattle. Combined weight of 17,000+lbs. Pretty darn good I'd say! Better than my old gaspot mileage of 7.6mpg for the same trip but only 13,000lbs. Twice the mileage, 4,000lbs more, twice the horsepower, amazing but true! I love this engine!

Derrek · July 11, 2012, 10:14 PM

Sent: 4/14/2005 8:24 AM

Here is some more info that I found on diesel engines. In another gas to diesel conversion thread, I mentioned the diesel powered Jeep Liberty. I found a review of the 2005 Jeep Liberty on allpar.com. I was mistaken about the diesel engine used in the Jeep Liberty. I thought it was the Mercedes diesel like the ones used in the Sprinter chassis, this article states that it is a Detroit diesel.

Here is a quote from the article with some interesting info on diesel engines:

Diesels are available on every Jeep model sold in Europe, from Wrangler to Grand Cherokee, but in America cheap gas and cheap cars, combined with troublesome and smoke-belching 1970s Mercedes and GM diesels, made the efficient but more expensive engines fairly rare outside of one-ton pickup trucks.

Diesel engines are common in Europe because they offer higher gas mileage and greater longevity; in a continent where people tend to keep their cars longer, and where fuel is more expensive, these factors offset the higher initial price. So does their lower maintenance (oil changes every 12,500 miles, for example), and their terrific torque at low engine speeds, which is handy in city traffic. Their roughly-20% lower carbon dioxide emissions are handy, too.

As an added factor in their favor, diesels can run on "grown and distilled" fuel - that is, biodiesel, which is a fluid with diesel-like properties made by distilling almond oil, soy, or various garden wastes. Biodiesel is grown naturally, does not require lots of outside energy for distillation (as alcohol and hydrogen do), and, when spilled, is generally not toxic. People can actually grow their own biodiesel fuel; Chrysler uses a 5% bio fuel ("B5," see sidebar) for Libertys as they leave the factories, but research has shown that pure biodiesel can be run in Cummins turbodiesels (used in Ram trucks) with no harm, and we suspect Libertys can run it equally well. (Pure biodiesel is fairly rare at commercial filling stations, even in Europe, but common in Germany, where it qualifies for tax breaks. As the EU phases in renewable-fuel laws, the proportion of bio to petrodiesel will increase.) Thus, diesels can actually be the most environmentally and socially friendly engines: they can preserve open space by helping farmers to stay in business, divert revenues from terror-supporting nations and businesses, and, because the fuel can be produced locally with very little energy input, producing and distributing biodiesel requires less fuel (oil brought in from the Middle East must be shipped by boat and refined - both steps require quite a bit of fuel).

The Liberty isn't given 100% biodiesel at the factory because, Chrysler's Max Gates told us, the fuel is still uncommon and not standardized in the US. "We are working with standards writing groups to develop standards for B20 - 20 percent biodiesel - so that we can endorse use of that fuel...B100 [100% biodiesel] - while it may be used by a few selective individuals - is not really productive at this point, since there are not enough supplies of the fuel to provide for much of the nation's diesel fleet. Better to mix that fuel with conventional diesel and stretch its benefits across more of the country."

If you would like to read the entire review, click below: (the section on the diesel engine option is about half way down the page)

http://www.allpar.com/model/jeep/liberty-review.html

denisondc · July 11, 2012, 10:15 PM

Sent: 4/14/2005 9:55 PM

I haven't seen any internet scuttlebutt about older diesel engine performance, like ones used in vehicles in the early 70s. That would be comparable to the V8 gasser in my Winnebago.
I worked with a guy who bought a new diesel Oldsmobile when they came out. Was that in 78? He was very happy with it, even after the crankshaft broke when he was driving back from his families vacation in Wisconsin, at about 49,500 miles on the 3 year old car. The warranty was for 50,000 miles or 5 years, so General Motors installed a new crankshaft for him, and paid for his rental car too.
He was getting 22-24 mpg on the highway, about 18-19 on his commute to work. He sold it before it had another 49k miles on the new crankshaft though.
I had a Mercedes Benz 180D for a while, I forget whether it was a 1956 or a 58. It had 180k miles on it, but its crankshaft had been replaced at 100k miles - after it snapped in the middle. The car was given to me after the dashboard caught fire, but I fixed what I needed to, including replacing the windshield and gasket.
It ran okay after I dismantled the injector pump and put in new "O" rings, (a tricky chore, but I wasnt going to pay for the cost of a rebuilt injector pump!!!) but it did not have much power; lots of shifting on hills in West Virginia and Western Maryland. I never felt inclined to use it for general transportation, and when my supply of overage home heating oil was about gone I gave it to a guy who had access to an 1100 gallon tank of agricultural diesel fuel on the farm where he worked. (like home heating oil - no taxes on it.)
My landlady bought a MB 300D when they first came out. That winter she was concerned about how long it took to start, when the temp. was in the single digits. I showed her that she could just repeat the cycle of "ign-on, let the glow plug tell tale go out, ign-off and ign-on again. etc". If she did that 3 or 4 times, it would start okay even at zero fahrenheit. She said it might be hard on the battery; so I opened the hood and showed her the size of the battery. She was reassured.

Derrek · July 11, 2012, 10:16 PM

Sent: 4/15/2005 7:50 AM

Thanks for the info Denison! Strange that you seem to have had so many negative experiences with diesel engines, mine have all been far better than my experiences with gasoline engines.

I agree with ideas of your "fuel supply", I wasn't going to mention that, being that it is "not exactly legal" to run non-tax fuel on the highway.

The longest I have owned a diesel powered vehicle was during my 4 years in the Navy. It was a 1980 Volkswagen Rabbit diesel. I chose this vehicle because of the fuel mileage (45-50mpg consistently) During our time out at sea, my car would sit on the base for months at a time. When I would return, It would always fire right up (using the glow plugs) and simply chug away as I used a small 12 volt air pump to re inflate the tires.

On my duty days, my buddies would always ask to borrow my car. Being that I didn't own anything at the time and did not fear a lawsuit, I would always let them use it. You can rest assured it was treated like a rental car while they were using it...lol
On the other hand, I wasn't very gentle with the car either. One of my favorite tricks was to pull up beside one of my buddies and rev the engine slightly and drop the clutch. The high torque diesel would burn the tires til they would smoke, while the engine belched black smoke out the exhaust pipe. My buddies always got a good laugh out of that. (Did I mention that in four years I put 2 clutch kits in as a result of this abuse!)

My buddies and I ran the crap out of the car for four years and I drove it from San Diego back to Ohio after I got out. When I got back home I had a car and a truck in storage that I owned before I joined the Navy, so something had to give. I made a mistake that I still regret. I sold the Volkswagen with it perfect condition southern CA body and rock solid diesel engine with 274,000 miles on it.

I have owned several diesel powered trucks, but I think that it would take at least a year of driving to give a fair evaluation. Each of these trucks were purchased at repo auctions and sold within several months after I purchased them. But I can say that Blue Book values for diesel powered trucks are always higher.

At my work, we have a John Deere diesel powered loader used to move coal. This engine has some of the worst operating conditions for a diesel engine(or any engine for that matter). It is started and run each shift for about 10 minutes at a time and is used 24/7 365 days a year. The engine has not been rebuilt and the only problem we have ever had was a lift pump going out. It starts first time, every time!

We have several gasoline forklifts that don't get used nearly as much or under the harsh conditions as the loader. After cranking and cranking and sometimes priming the carb, they will start.

On the other hand, remember all of the problems I had with the "mystery miss" on my 440 in my Apollo. What about the "little or no vacuum" thread here that was so similar to the problems I had. I have never spent weeks chasing a miss in a diesel engine.

I have a 1988 Dodge Dakota with a 3.9 V6. I purchased the truck 5 years ago with 79,000 miles on it. It now has 90,000. The list of things I have had to repair on this truck is unreal. On a good day, with the truck completely empty, I am lucky to get 15 mpg. It is a standard shift 4 speed with OD!

When a diesel engine stops running altogether, it is almost always due to a lack of fuel. (Usually a lift pump). It is possible to have injector problems and other issues, but this usually will only drop one cylinder or cause the cylinder to miss-fire.

One the other hand, If my gasoline engine in my motor home were to quit while going down the highway, it could be an ignition switch, coil, cap, rotor, points or electronic ignition, a loose wire, lack of fuel the list goes on and on....

All of the above is simply my opinion based upon my personal experience. Regardless if it is diesel, gasoline, or some type of hybrid, I would like to see our country focus on more fuel efficient vehicles.

Congratulations again on your retirement Dave!
Isn't today the big day? 4-15-2005?

uglydukwling · July 11, 2012, 10:16 PM

Sent: 4/29/2005 12:17 AM

I have an old Dodge motor home I was planning to convert to diesel. While I was trying to decide whether to use one of the engines I have or wait for a good deal on a Cummins to turn up, I came across a '78 Elandan II 27 foot that had already been converted. It has a Perkins 354 turbo, the original 727 tranny and a Gear Vendors overdrive. The present owner didn't do the conversion so I don't have a lot of information about how it was done or how hard it was. I'd welcome any comments on this combination (what kind of performance to expect, anything to watch out for, etc.) If I do buy it, I'll try to keep the forum updated on how it works.

ClydesdaleKevin · July 11, 2012, 10:17 PM

Sent: 4/29/2005 2:21 AM

I had an old rusted out diesel VW Rabbit pickup truck for years (back in the late 80s). Back then diesel was CHEAPER than even regular gas in Connecticut, and that ugly little truck got 40 mpg! It was damn ugly, smelly, and the engine was loud and clackity...but it had over 300,000 miles on it, ran like a top, started on even the coldest days, and like I said, got 40mpg. I finally had to junk the poor thing when I went over some railroad tracks and the bed folded into the cab from the rust...lmao.

Kev and Patti Smith

Derrek · July 11, 2012, 10:18 PM

Sent: 4/29/2005 12:52 PM

Here is some info about Perkins engines used in Dodge trucks:

http://www.sweptline.com/hist/pd500.jpg

http://www.sweptline.com/hist/bigtrucks.html

Aaron Arnold's W-300 Diesel (PW-300?)
Images submitted by Aaron Arnold.
Aaron Arnold of Boerne, Texas, owns this one of a kind Perkins Diesel powered W-300. The truck is the only Perkins Diesel powered W-300 known to exist and one of a rare few W-300 Crew Cab Trucks. Although originally equipped to haul horses, the truck now has a Utiline bed on the rear of the chassis (see photos below). This unique truck has the following specifications:

* 354 ci Six Cylinder Perkins Diesel Engine, English built (Eng. # 8044081)
* 146" wheelbase
* NP 420 Transmission with special bell housing
* NP 201 Twin-Stick Transfer Case
* Dana 70 Front and Rear Differentials (4.88:1 gears)
* Dual Rear Wheels
* MU-2A Braden PTO Winch (10,000lb capacity)
* Dual Batteries
* Dash mounted Throttle Pull Handle
* Mechanical Tachometer with hours meter
* Medium Duty Truck Steering Wheel
* Full Length Running Boards
* Power Brakes with Vacuum Pump and reserve tank
* Diesel Fender Emblems under Dodge Emblems (same script)
* Cold Weather Start decal, pull knob and ether bottle on firewall
* Pull to Stop Engine decal with knob
* Use Diesel Fuel Only decal along with 20 gallon tank behind seat
* Chrysler Perkins Industrial Diesel decal on valve cover
* Bostrom Viking T-bar seats (possibly a dealer installed option)

* Interesting Statistics: PW-300 Curb Weight: 6,860lbs
* Gas Mileage: 17-18 at 65 mph
* Engine Oil Capacity: 16.5 quarts

DaveVA78Chieftain · July 11, 2012, 10:26 PM

I know this subject occasionally comes up and ran across this pictorial of converting a M400 440 chassis in a 75 Travco to a diesel. From the chassis perspective, M400 is a M400. Lots of pictures and sort of puts things into perspective.

http://community.webshots.com/album/232660691ZBdqUT?start=0

Dave

Wantawinnie · July 11, 2012, 10:27 PM

Thanks for posting that link Dave. I had seen it previously but not looked at it in some time. I have been thinking about this and would love to convert my Chieftain over to diesel and store the 440 away for safe keeping. I have a 1989 Dodge parts truck with a Cummins that would be an ideal donor.

I do want to mention the diesel in this swap is a P-pump 94-97 Dodge engine. The chassis changed in 1994 and shares nothing with the earlier trucks. I think using the earlier 89-93 Dodge version would be easier in some respects. I believe the motor mounts and frame are very similar between the truck and motorhome chassis. The 440 to diesel swap in a standard pickup is a bolt in deal. Some small shimming may be required and I am going to investigate the mounts further. The injection pump is also smaller on the 89-93 so the engine may not be quite as hard to position. My diesel is not intercooled so that would eliminate some problems also. I recall reading that the exhaust manifold from a Ford bus application is low mount to get that fitting better.

Lots to measure and think about but it would be a cool swap.