1972 Vw lil bugger - serious body sag advice needed - VIDEO ADDED

[Thenoob]

Hello world!

   This is my new to me super rare 72 Vw lil bugger "motorhome".  Super ugly and super awesome.

   Big problem, upon initial teardown, massive sag on the plywood outer floors over the years have made the side seats also sag.  Is their ANY way to repair this?

   I've done a shell off restoration of an airstream but I have no idea how to take the structural force, and hold up the weight and fix the floor to get it back to level.

   I don't want to give up on the project but I can't go any further until a proper game plan for a fix.  If anyone has any ideas I would love to discuss it with you.

    The rest of it is clean and dry , it's just this rear end sag is very bad.

Thanks in advance
Thenoob

Greetings by the way!!

[Thenoob]

The problem are these guys on both sides.. One side is just screwed into the frame the outer is just screwed into the wood framing so nothing ran side to side to support it.

That's why it has sagged so much... I'm guessing 3-4 inches on both sides

[M & J]

My advice is to ship it to me - immediately.

Dang I'd love to own one of those..... We currently have 2 VWs, but I have zero knowledge of how they married the camper to the beetle pan.
Jealousy is oozing from my eyeballs. If there is any assistance I can give on the beetle part, let me know.
Welcome to the forum.

The bottom pic I see the torsion bar cap and IRS confrol arm so they have welded supports for the camper side walls to the pan and/or heater  channels. Post or PM me more pics from that area and underneath looking forward. We'll start with the frame support and work up from there.

[Thenoob]

Thanks for the quick reply

Here's some more shots

They basically ran a plate beside the pan and attached it to it, then screwed down the outer floor panels into it... Big mistake not running a cross section or 2 to stop this from happening.

I'm really not sure how to fix it.  I pulled to 1600 dual port and have a 2.1l waterboxer that I'm going to put in it, but before that happens I gotta shore up this huge problem.

Re framing the seats and counter is easy easy, but the floor not so much.

[Thenoob]

One more for shaggy giggles and awesome fun

[cosmic]

why not jack it all back up. if it doesn't go up then the plate is bent. which means you would have to remove the wood to use heat, or force. and then jack it until it goes back into place.
looks like some heavy cross members need to be welded across from side to side. Now is there ground clearance for cross members or will it need to be done on the inside.?

beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[M & J]

Wow. So theres no structural support to keep the extensions from sagging like they have? I didnt see any strength members under the side extensions so I was hoping they had cantelevered support from the center, overhead to help support the roof, then down to help hold the walls. Kinda like a roll cage is done if you get where I'm going.

[Thenoob]

I was thinking about trying that, jacking it up, only where the hell to jack it lol
Could try and put it right where it's sagging but I'm worried about straight snapping it.

Ideal solution it to jack it up to level and yes install a crossbeam setup for support.  There's clearance for crossmembers under there ya.  I'm in the shop right now messing with it, I have the back end as high as she will go with the air shocks.

I agree with ya, I think they are totally awesome little creations.  Gotta love the 70's

[Thenoob]

Nope no outer support at all which I found very weird. Ya if only they did the frame in aluminum square tube this thing would kick so much bum!

[M & J]

Just ship it to me and I'll figure something out.   Keep me posted.

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

I think you will need to construct some sort of frame like a dunebuggy to attach the walls to.  An example to expand on


A case of the house is only as good as it's foundation

Dave

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

You might get some ideas from some of these sites:
Google


That conversion was originally posted in Popular Mechanics years ago

https://www.rqriley.com/minihome.html

Dave

[Thenoob]

Hi Dave

   I think I'm familiar with every discussion online about the bugger, problem is barely any of them remain in the world that nobody really has them, out
Of the 200 made I think there's probably only a handful left

   I wish they engineered these things better!!

On goes the journey!!
You guys are great!

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

The original plans may help you resolve the issues.

Dave

[Thenoob]

I bought them about a year ago when I got her.

The big problem in the original design was the lack of a crossmember support on those floors, the two others I have talked to who own them say they have the same issue unfort.

[DaveVA78Chieftain]

ahh, ok. Well I revert back to my original suggestion. exoskeleton frame.

Dave

[Thenoob]

Hahaha oh man I totally agree
Although a massive retro fit

A job that will last for a long time tho

[Stripe]

Wow..   OldRockandRoller must be going nuts..

How about it? You doing okay ORaR??

Oh, and Thenoob?  Welcome to the funny farm!!

[ClydesdaleKevin]

You can fix it!  Sweat and creativity go a long way anywhere but Wallstreet!...lol!

Jack it up level to where its supposed to be, then design your crossmembers.  You very well might have to run wall supports up the shell, since a VW bug was designed as a unibody, to give it enough structure.  But anything can be done if you want it bad enough and aren't afraid to work for it.

Kev

[Oz]

Take a look here... it's the gallery ablum icon...

http://www.classicwinnebagos.com/forum/index.php?action=mgallery;sa=item;id=2102

Look familiar?

[M & J]

I am going nuts. Worse than I already was. Hes got to be cautious on raising the sides so the whole thing doesnt fracture and split apart.
I was thinking rigging an overhead boom sling, slowly raising both side equally from above instead of jacking from below. A slow prcoess to keep from blowing the whole thing apart. Then come back in and add the support members previously discussed.
Or ship it to me and it will be my problem....  lol

[Thenoob]

Thanks for all the input

Another option is how I did my boler and airstream... Could brace the whole interior side to side front to back and attempt to remove it from the chassis.

That's a big job but it would completely clear it off??

I'm going to get back under it first thing in the morning and gameplan a bit...

[Thenoob]

Mark good link!

They look sweet when all done... Or I could say screw it and buy this 72 brave 18ft for 350 bucks??!?

Or both!!

[Oz]

The unamimous answer for that would be to get both.  A word of caution though, at $350, I would suspect that you would be getting into whatever issues you might have with the VW only in Godzilla size version, mutliplied by at least 10, and you could end up with 2 long term projects and an empty wallet.

I'll add that, you could disassemble the VW coach since it appears to be a basket case already.  Consider all the wood... that's a lot of weight to either jack-up OR lift.  And if you're going to need to buid an adequate framework, consider this...

You could vastly reduce the weight and vastly increase the driveability of the entire vehicle by replacing as much wood as possible with aluminum tubing and other lightweight materials.

[Thenoob]

That's exactly the way I'm leaning...

Aluminum would reduce so much weight and longevity to the project that it might be worth looking at

If only I could weld.... Good.